Program Notes
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Guest speaker: Terence McKenna
In this recording, Terence McKenna discusses his wave theory, which he claims predicts every moment up until December 21, 2012. He addresses the common question of what happens after this date, suggesting a series of increasingly strange scenarios. A less strange scenario he proposes involves a sudden shift in human behavior where everyone begins to act appropriately, inspired by Buddhist and Taoist principles. McKenna humorously imagines that this might lead people to take off their clothes and go outside, although he admits he can’t predict what would happen beyond that point.
Among other things, he says, “I think, in a sense, technology is the the alchemical journey toward the condensation of the soul, and the union of spirit and matter in some kind of hyper-object.”
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Transcript
00:00:00 ►
Three-dimensional transforming musical linguistic objects.
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Delphishol.
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Greetings from cyberdelic space.
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This is Lorenzo and I’m your host here in the psychedelic salon.
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And today, once again, we delve into the visionary mind of Terrence McKenna,
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who was not only a pioneering and theobotanist.
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He was also a mystic and philosopher.
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Now, this interesting talk brings to an end, a workshop where Terence was exploring what may happen
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at the end of the time wave.
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As he notes, his idea predicts every moment up until December 21st, 2012.
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And now, finally, he tackles the intriguing question of,
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what happens after this date?
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And in doing so, he presents several scenarios,
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ranging from the plausible to the profoundly weird.
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Actually, this is a good example of Terrence’s imaginative vision of a future,
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where he humorously contemplates a world where everyone begins to behave appropriately,
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which to his mind includes taking off all of our clothes and going out into nature,
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which sounds good unless nature is extremely cold or hot at the time
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or any of the other things it does to encourage us to wear clothing.
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But anyhow, that was his idea, and it’s as good as any, I guess.
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Now, this is the last session of this October 1995 workshop at the Esselin Institute at
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Big Sur, California.
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And hopefully you’ll find one or two new ideas here that hadn’t crossed your mind before.
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Now, here’s Terrence.
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The funny thing is, here I have this wave.
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It predicts every second between here and December 21st, 2012, I show it to people,
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and their first question is, so what happens afterwards?
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It doesn’t address that.
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It addresses all moments before that.
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Nevertheless, I feel the force of the question,
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and I’ve created a series of scenarios
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in ascending weirdness, which answer the question.
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A low weirdness answer would be suddenly everyone begins to behave appropriately.
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This is kind of a Buddhist Taoist. Now, the interesting thing about that scenario is the first 30 seconds of that we can predict appropriate
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behavior would probably be to take your foot off your neighbor’s neck, step back from what
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you’re doing, and then I always imagined, for some reason, I don’t know why, that everybody would
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take off their clothes and go outside.
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Well, then I said,
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but after that, I can’t figure, you know,
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that’s the first 30 seconds of appropriate behavior.
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Well, it would change the context of reality so radically
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that predicting what would be appropriate in the next 30 seconds is impossible.
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And so we would just dissolve into appropriate behavior.
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And since we’ve never had that, we can’t imagine what it would be like.
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So that’s one possibility.
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Then there’s the transformation of physics scenario,
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which basically says all boundaries dissolve.
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And I think what that would probably be like,
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would be like, or the first hour of it
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would be like about 1,000 micrograms of LSD.
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After that, we can’t imagine or predict,
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because again, it would have so totally changed the context
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that you could no longer predict it.
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Then there are the catastrophic scenarios
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that revolve around the question death, where is thy sting?
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And probably the most efficient of those is the planetesimal impact scenario.
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A very large object strikes the earth and kills everybody and that’s that.
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A blunt object.
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It’s a blunt solution.
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Sort of in that same category of the catastrophic solutions is the blue star in Sagittarius that
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we talked about yesterday and then a kind of intermediate between those two, which is the blue star in Sagittarius that we talked about yesterday, and then a kind of intermediate between those two,
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which is the sun will explode and fulfill the whole thing.
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The planet vaporizes,
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and collectively we and all life on Earth move into the shimmering castles
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of the post-mortem realm, whatever that is.
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Novel, novel.
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Let’s see, so there’s that.
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But recently, I’ve sort of, because when I work with the time wave,
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though I argued strenuously last night that it reflects all ebb and flow of novelty,
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somebody will come up with something like the release of Sergeant Pepper or the O.J. thing or something like that.
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And then we see that it’s kind of lost in the noise.
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And then there’s a big debate about is the theory right or isn’t the theory wrong,
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how important was that event and so forth and so on so what it what the wave seems most pristinely to predict
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or what parallels the wave most closely is the evolution of technology. And I think technology is something
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that we haven’t really understood. You know, in French, it’s technique, and it’s an Aristotelian
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absolute. It works differently than in English. And I think, in a sense, technology is the
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alchemical journey
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toward the condensation of the soul
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and the union of spirit and matter
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in some kind of hyper object.
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So the rise of the World Wide Web
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has been a great boost to my fantasies along these lines, because now I can see with the web from here to the Eschaton.
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Apparently, it’s a technology for dissolving space, time, personality, and just releasing everybody into a data stream
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or something like that,
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something like the imagination.
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Then that’s why, though we didn’t talk about it too much here,
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the ultimate technological fantasy
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along this line of thought
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is what is conventionally called a time machine.
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And in fact, there’s an interesting aspect to the time machine the wave describes the ebb and flow of
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novelty in time but then you reach a point where it’s so novel that it fails
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beyond that point well a time-traffling technology would cause such a system to fail
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because it’s a description of the unfolding seriality of linear events,
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which a time machine would disrupt.
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So it may be that it isn’t the explosion of the sun or the coming of the aliens or the descent of the third person or the second person of the Trinity.
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It’s simply that a technology is put in place that destroys linear time.
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And from thence forward, when you give your address, you have to say not only where but when.
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There are some problems with this.
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And then here is a slightly more interesting and woo-woo scenario,
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which is the thing that’s always held out against time travel,
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especially time travel into the past,
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is what’s called the grandfather paradox.
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Somebody pointed out it’s not called the father paradox,
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because apparently we want to avoid an edible situation here.
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It’s called the grandfather paradox, and it is simply the following objection.
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If you could travel into the past, you could kill your grandfather. It’s called the grandfather paradox, and it is simply the following objection.
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If you could travel into the past, you could kill your grandfather.
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If you killed your grandfather, you wouldn’t exist.
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Therefore, you couldn’t travel into the past.
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Therefore, time travel is impossible.
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There’s an interesting variation on it called The Watch Paradox, which is,
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now let me see if I can get it right.
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Forget it.
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I’m not certain of it.
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Okay, so the grandfather paradox seems to make time travel into the past impossible.
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One idea I had for an end of history scenario is how about this? Over the next 17 years time travel becomes more and more discussable. Finally there are laboratories working on it. Finally there is a prototype machine. Finally, it’s possible to conceive a test. And so on the morning of December 21st, 2012, at the World Temporal Institute headquarters in the Amazon basin, via a
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worldwide high-definition three-dimensional hookup, the entire world tunes in to see the first flight into time
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and the lady tempo knot comes to the microphone makes a few brief statements hands are shaken the
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champagne is smashed she climbs into her time machine, pushes the button, and disappears into the far-flung
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reaches of the future. Now, the interesting question is what happens next? And I’ve already
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established for myself that you can travel backward into the past, but you can’t travel further into the past than the invention of the first time machine.
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I mentioned that for the simple reason that there are no time machines before that, and if you were to take one where there are none, you get another paradox.
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So what happens when the lady tempo knot slips into the future?
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Well, I think what would happen a millisecond later is
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tens of thousands of time machines would arrive from all points in the future,
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having come back through time, of course,
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to witness the first flight into time,
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exactly as if you could fly your beachcraft back to Kitty Hawk, North Carolina,
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to that windy morning when the Wright brothers rolled their flyer out and fueled her up.
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Because they know how to ruin that.
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And that’s as far as the road goes.
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That’s the end of the time road.
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But the grandfather paradox persists.
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One of those time travelers from 5,000 years in the future,
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on their way back to the first time travel incident,
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could stop and kill their grandfather,
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and then we have this whole problem all over again.
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So I thought about this for a long time, and I think I’ve found my way around it, but as usual,
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at the cost of further weirdness. Here’s what would really happen if we invented a time machine of that sort.
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The lady temponaut pushes the button, and instead of all time machines appearing instantly in the next moment,
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in order to preserve the system from that paradox, what will happen is the rest of the history of the
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universe will occur instantly. And so that’s it. I call it the god whistle. This is because
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you thought you were building a time machine. And in a sense you were building a time machine. And in a sense, you were building a time machine.
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But the time machine isn’t what you thought it was.
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It caused the rest of time to happen instantaneously.
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And so the furthest out developments of life, matter, and technology in the universe
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come right up against you, a millisecond after you break that barrier.
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And in fact, you discover that travel in time is not travel in time.
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It’s a doorway into eternity, which is all time.
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And that’s why it becomes more like a hyperspacial deal than a simple
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linear time travel thing so it’s something like this now then there’s been a
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parallel development which has caused me to feel even more confident which is
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we’re now beginning to build this parallel world
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called the World Wide Web. And it’s, you can bet that long before we reach 2012,
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the major religions of the world will build virtual realities of their eschatological scenarios.
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So, you know, there will be the Islamic paradise, the Christian millennium, the Buddhist
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Chunyatta, these will be channels that you tune into to see if you like it and want to join.
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So in a sense, guaranteed we will have a virtual singularity.
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And then the only question then is a technological and engineering one.
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How real can the virtual eschaton be?
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And I think that the distinction between virtual reality
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and ordinary reality is probably a habitual and societal one
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and that it will break down over the next 17 years
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so that this question will be meaningless by the time we get to it.
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One thing you have to remember when you try to think inside this system is it’s all very well
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to try and understand the end point, but recall that where we are relative to the endpoint
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is in resonance with the 950 AD. In other words, we’re like people in
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950 AD trying to understand the World Wide Web, the hydrogen bomb, and the CAT scanner. How can we?
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My God, you know, we don’t even have the calculus yet.
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Newton hasn’t been born yet, let alone Einstein.
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I mean, we’re running around essentially we’re primitives, is what I’m saying.
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We don’t have tools yet to conceive of the object at 2012.
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We must build those tools between now and then. And good places
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to start are with the World Wide Web, psychedelic drugs, whatever is most cutting edge and most
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far out. But we have to take those from a 10th century level of development to a 20th century level of development in 17 years
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in order to have the metaphors, the technologies to understand what is happening to it.
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So a great deal has to happen between now and then.
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You know, next year I mentioned this Islamic and Sung dynasty resonance.
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Well, then in 2004, I think, we reached the Italian Renaissance.
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In 2006, we reach the European Enlightenment.
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In 2011, we reached the edge of the 20th century.
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So the real unfolding of the understanding of the Eschaton will occur in the 18 months preceding
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its revelation.
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So the amazing thing is that primitive as we are, we’re able to pick this thing up.
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And, you know, I finished the theory in 72 well before the crucifixion.
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So there has been, you know, a thread throughout all of history of this thing,
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but it can’t possibly be understood very well
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until we get closer to it. Right now, it’s just an undefined spec on the horizon of time,
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but we’re rushing toward it at an enormous speed. Yeah.
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I think one thing that might be very interesting that somebody could come up with the
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replacement for the periodic cable of the elements.
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And at least there’s a way to, I met a physicist, but to take a step in that direction,
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and that is to map out the elements in their quark constituents instead of based on protons and neutrons
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and how the current periodic cable of the elements is laid out.
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But I think that as something that they’ll overthrow that and build up a model cable of the elements is laid out. But I think that something that could overthrow that
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and build up a model of the way reality is structured.
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I don’t think very much of our intellectual furniture
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is going to be in use past 2000.
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That seems a pivotal piece of that furniture
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to be tossed out and replace with something.
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Well, again, the coordination of knowledge is part of the problem.
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Probably what you’re talking about is well underway.
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You know, the quantum theories of matter can build up everything out of a very few basic constituents.
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But as I say, I think most of our metaphors will be replaced. I mean,
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right now, it’s the net that is hot. But the net will be perfected well before 2000. You know,
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it will be fiber optic or satellite. It will be worldwide. It will be virtual, the bandwidth will be enormous,
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and it’ll all be done. I think the final technology before the technology of the
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Eschaton itself will be nanotechnology. And, you know, we can only, except for a very few
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people, we can hardly conceive of a nanotechnological world.
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It’s a world where China eats out of machines
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that change seafloor mud into Basmati rice,
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trillions of cubic meters of it per day.
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The holy grail of the nanotechnologists is this thing called a matter compiler.
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A matter compiler can do with physical objects what an SGI indigo can do with images.
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In other words, it’s a three-dimensional computer that makes objects out of raw atoms.
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Not only nanotech objects, nanocytes, and stuff like that, but any object.
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I mean, you need a bicycle.
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You’ll step into something like a telephone booth, run your credit card through.
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It’ll say, please wait three minutes, 15 seconds. into something like a telephone booth, run your credit card through.
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It’ll say, please wait three minutes, 15 seconds,
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and a bicycle will rise off the plate assembled by these nanocytes that are being fed a slurry of ocean mud with all the elements in it,
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and all objects will be assembled this way. This isn’t science fiction.
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What about mushroom? Could you order that mushroom?
00:22:10 ►
Oh, well, that’s another question. Obviously, the first nanotech objects will be things like
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cubes of gold, cubes of carbon, cubes of diamond. Can nanotech build life? That’s your question, basically. I imagine that will,
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the question will be answered fairly close to the eschatonic condensation. But people are at work
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on these things. Not only at work, they’re doing it. I mean, I keep talking about the 10,000
00:22:43 ►
steam engines on a one centimeter by one
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centimeter chip. That’s history. It was done 18 months ago. Those steam engines each produce
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one 10,000th of a millinuton of force. Each one of them costs a penny and a half. And those 10,000
00:23:02 ►
steam engines on that one centimeter chip represent more steam engines than
00:23:08 ►
were in England in 1850 at the height of the age of steam. So, you know, we’re on the brink,
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not even on the brink. I mean, that technology exists. They’re running as we speak somewhere
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near Palo Alto.
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It’s hard not to think of a forbidden planet, but it’s science fiction film where
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it is his math. Robbie the robot making a pint of bourbon in his little front
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burner. Yeah, well he obviously had a matter compiler built in.
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Can you briefly say with that Eschaton?
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Eschaton is simply the last thing.
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That’s what it means. It’s the last thing.
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Yeah.
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Yeah. Esch, in Greek is last. So all, and I believe all tools are anticipations of the last tool.
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Our task is to build the tool.
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And every tool we’ve ever built from the lunar lander to the Aculane hand axe was a prototype
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of the last tool.
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And what’s interesting about computers is before computers,
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tools were task defined.
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In other words, you needed to drive a nail, you needed a hammer,
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you needed to screw a screw, you needed a screwdriver.
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What a computer is, at the most basic engineering level is simply thousands and thousands of switches.
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Set them one way, it’ll give you a hell of a game of pong.
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Set it another way, it will balance your checkbook. Another way, it will predict the the weather so what a computer is is a very
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crude version of the hyper machine the machine which can do anything and uh this is the culmination
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of the alchemical dream it’s the idea of the union of spirit and matter so that the modality and
00:25:27 ►
an ontos of each is preserved somehow within a paradox. And I think the persistence of this idea
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and ideas like the approaching end of the world and God’s promise to enter history and all this irrational stuff like flying saucers.
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I consider my answer to the question, what are flying saucers is there are reflections of the eschaton that haunt time like distorted reflections. If you think of the eschaton as one of those mirrored balls
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that they hang in clubs that throw light on the wall,
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a disco ball. Yes.
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Think of the eschaton as a disco ball.
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Well, then each of those little reflections,
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I mean, hear a Christ, here a Buddha,
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those are sort of like straight on reflections. But here an Eichmann, here a Christ, here a Buddha, those are sort of like straight on reflections.
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But here an Eichmann, here a Nixon,
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these are tweaked images of it.
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And every person and every object and every situation
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and every system and everything
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is an anticipation of and a distorted image of the eschaton.
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Because it is entirely perfect.
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It’s God, except I just hate that word, because it brings so much freight with it.
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Yeah.
00:26:59 ►
So why look towards the technologies?
00:27:02 ►
Why not look towards the yogis that have found ways to sit and get out of their body?
00:27:08 ►
Why isn’t that the way you go?
00:27:10 ►
Well, I define technology very broadly.
00:27:13 ►
I mean, Merciliad, God bless his heart, who wrote the best book ever written on shamanism,
00:27:21 ►
subtitled it.
00:27:22 ►
The name of the book is shamanism, the archaic techniques of ecstasy.
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He wrote it in French. So it was technique. He knew it sounds different in French. Shaman’s are
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technologists. Iliad wrote another book called The Forge and the Crucible in which he talks about
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how the smith and the shaman are brothers,
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and they are united in their fascination with metals.
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The artificer, the maker of things, is the magician.
00:28:01 ►
And nanotechnology and yoga aren’t that much different.
00:28:06 ►
If you read my book True Hallucinations, one way of reading that book is that we were the first
00:28:16 ►
nanotechnological engineers because what is proposed in that book is that you can take
00:28:24 ►
a drug psilocybin and using acoustical sound,
00:28:30 ►
using sound in certain frequencies, you can interrupt the ordinary destiny of that molecule inside the body
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and instead force it into a complex with DNA and then the psychedelic molecule
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acts like a broadband transceiver and broadcasts the contents of the DNA into the higher cortical
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functions that we call consciousness.
00:29:04 ►
And it may not work like that, but that’s how nanotechnologists
00:29:09 ►
think.
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They think of building little machines that you inject into your bloodstream that then go.
00:29:16 ►
And, you know, in some of the more mundane scenarios, they ream out cholesterol and snip off polyps
00:29:24 ►
and this sort of thing.
00:29:25 ►
But that’s health maintenance.
00:29:27 ►
We’re talking about something a little more, you know, ambitious than that.
00:29:34 ►
We’re talking about figuring out where in the organic matrix memory and consciousness
00:29:39 ►
resides and then jerking out the evolved wetware and putting in something with much broader
00:29:47 ►
bandwidth and speed of response that can carry us deeper into our imagination.
00:29:54 ►
Could you elaborate more I’m using mushrooms and or other psychotropics as tools or maps?
00:30:03 ►
As I see this end of time, almost like an Einstein’s watch type of theory, you know,
00:30:08 ►
unless we can actually see what’s going on in there,
00:30:11 ►
it might be a bunch of hamsters running around.
00:30:13 ►
Using psychedelics as a map or tool to get that different perspective,
00:30:19 ►
that different angle might give us the inside we need to figure out what may be happening near the end of time.
00:30:26 ►
Yeah, I mean, here’s my model of what psychedelics do. I mean, there are many models. There’s the
00:30:33 ►
opens the valve of information model. That was Aldous Huxley. There’s the plunges you into the
00:30:40 ►
collective unconscious model, which is maybe Stan’s take.
00:30:46 ►
A number of, and then the people who hate psychedelics say it’s just neurological confusion.
00:30:52 ►
There are these different models of what it is.
00:30:54 ►
I’ve spent a lot of time with mathematicians, and I’ve spent a lot of time loaded,
00:31:00 ►
and I think that why psychedelics are more than simply personal and like that,
00:31:09 ►
is that what psychedelics do is they put your mind literally into hyperspace,
00:31:20 ►
or they put your perceiving apparatus into hyperspace,
00:31:26 ►
real hyperspace, not metaphorical, but mathematical hyperspace.
00:31:31 ►
Ralph says this.
00:31:33 ►
He’s a four or five, six-dimensional geometerone,
00:31:36 ►
who smokes DMT,
00:31:38 ►
and he says, same-o, same-o, you know?
00:31:42 ►
No div.
00:31:44 ►
That’s what it is.
00:31:45 ►
These are higher-dimensional spaces.
00:31:48 ►
And to me, the proof of this,
00:31:51 ►
people sometimes knock my approach to psychedelics
00:31:55 ►
because they say I put too much emphasis on hallucination.
00:31:58 ►
Why am I not satisfied with insights, feelings, bonding.
00:32:07 ►
You know, why this hammering intensity about visuals?
00:32:11 ►
Well, here’s why.
00:32:14 ►
You can see your body.
00:32:18 ►
You know you have an appendix and a pancreas,
00:32:22 ►
but I dare say very few of us have ever seen our pancreas.
00:32:28 ►
That’s because it’s inside your body where you can’t see.
00:32:32 ►
Well, but we could see it.
00:32:35 ►
We could take anesthetics, open ourselves up, make films anyway, or maybe use a local,
00:32:41 ►
say, yes, I do have a pancreas.
00:32:43 ►
But the most interesting organ of the human body,
00:32:48 ►
and interestingly enough, the sexiest as well,
00:32:52 ►
is the mind, the mind.
00:32:55 ►
But where is it?
00:32:57 ►
You can’t see it, even if you’re willing to undergo anesthesia
00:33:02 ►
and sort through cell by cell, you can’t find it.
00:33:07 ►
Why can’t you find the mind?
00:33:09 ►
When you feel it all the time, it’s always with you, it’s more you than this or this, but never seen.
00:33:19 ►
The reason you can’t see the mind is because it’s in another dimension.
00:33:29 ►
you can’t see the mind is because it’s in another dimension. It’s the hyperspacial organ of human beings. We have a hyperspacial organ, and you can never find it no matter how you slice and dice.
00:33:37 ►
But if you take psychedelics enough that you see hallucinations, that is your mind.
00:33:49 ►
You are seeing your own mental processes, and that’s a clear indication to me that you are now in hyperspace.
00:33:59 ►
In hyperspace, the mind becomes visible. And that’s why the stress on vision,
00:34:07 ►
because if you’re just having complex thoughts and feelings,
00:34:11 ►
then you’re loaded, your brain is agitated,
00:34:14 ►
your neurons are popping,
00:34:16 ►
you’re processing memory and trauma and hope and anticipation.
00:34:20 ►
But you’re not yet in hyperspace.
00:34:24 ►
In hyperspace, the mind is as visible as my left hand is to me in ordinary space.
00:34:33 ►
And so if we want to understand the mind and describe it, we need to see it.
00:34:40 ►
And therefore, we have to take psychedelics.
00:34:43 ►
So then what the psychedelic experience becomes,
00:34:47 ►
the full-blown, high-dose, boundary-dissolving,
00:34:51 ►
nail you to the floor dose, the heroic dose,
00:34:56 ►
what it becomes, stop copulating,
00:35:00 ►
what it becomes is an anticipation of the eschaton.
00:35:08 ►
That’s what you see in hyperspace.
00:35:11 ►
In hyperspace, the end of the world can be seen on the horizon,
00:35:17 ►
the way the sun can be seen on the horizon in 3D.
00:35:21 ►
So, in a sense, psychedelics are a technique for turning to the end of the story and reading
00:35:29 ►
the last paragraph.
00:35:32 ►
And I think that’s what psychedelic people are.
00:35:35 ►
That’s why I’m so casual about acceptance or non-acceptance.
00:35:40 ►
Because everything’s already dead.
00:35:42 ►
I’ve been there.
00:35:43 ►
I’ve been to the end.
00:35:44 ►
When you go there, you realize everything’s already dead, right?
00:35:48 ►
Is that one way you would put it?
00:35:49 ►
That’s the way that I would put it.
00:35:51 ►
I would put it done.
00:35:52 ►
Yeah?
00:35:53 ►
Done.
00:35:54 ►
Everything is done.
00:35:57 ►
It’s a done deal, folks.
00:36:00 ►
And I’m just, you know, I feel like I am inside an enormous joke. And that to some degree, each of you know, I’m just, you know, I feel like I am inside an enormous joke. And that to some degree, each of you know, I’m just, I feel like I’m just, I feel like, I’m just you know, I’m just you know, I’m just, you know, I feel like I am inside an enormous joke.
00:36:08 ►
And that to some degree each of you is, too, to the degree that you understand what’s going on here, what’s really going on here.
00:36:18 ►
Yeah.
00:36:19 ►
So then the best thing, then all you can do is act with style and a certain panache and try to carry
00:36:27 ►
things forward, keep everybody happy, keep the levels of anxiety under control.
00:36:33 ►
And it’s a huge, huge joke of some sort.
00:36:41 ►
And, you know, the real belly laugh is beyond the yawning grave and then you just look back and
00:36:47 ►
say you know why didn’t why didn’t I see it it was in front of me all the time and I lived my
00:36:56 ►
whole life in anxiety and doubt and frustration and this and that the other thing because I just
00:37:03 ►
didn’t didn’t understand it.
00:37:05 ►
So the kind of laid back, chilled out quality of psychedelic people is simply that, you know,
00:37:12 ►
they’ve been there, they’ve done that, and now they’re just living without the illusion of history.
00:37:20 ►
It is not the eschaton that is the illusion.
00:37:28 ►
It is history that is illusion,
00:37:35 ►
three-dimensional space, causality, the structures that we allowed our languages and our science and our mathematics to put in place to delude us over the last several thousand years. What is the dose of state?
00:37:49 ►
No, no.
00:37:54 ►
I weigh roughly 150, and I take five grams.
00:37:56 ►
Or more. No, not that combination.
00:38:01 ►
No, I know that a lot of that’s being done, but one of the roughest nights I ever spent
00:38:10 ►
was a half dose of mushrooms with a half dose of ayahuasca.
00:38:15 ►
And I got into a place that was mighty, mighty alarming.
00:38:21 ►
And I’ll describe it for you because it didn’t you know it wasn’t about how I
00:38:28 ►
mistreated my pets or something like that I took I took like two and a half
00:38:36 ►
grams of mushrooms and a half a hit of ayahuasca and about an hour and a half into it I
00:38:42 ►
became really anxious.
00:38:50 ►
And so, naturally, when you’re anxious, you ask the question, what’s wrong?
00:38:51 ►
So I thought, what’s wrong?
00:38:58 ►
And then I searched my physiology and scanned the surrounding environment, and the answer was,
00:39:00 ►
nothing’s wrong.
00:39:02 ►
So, oh, okay, good, nothing’s wrong. So then I try to go back to the meditation, and this enormous anxiety rises, something’s wrong.
00:39:10 ►
What’s wrong?
00:39:11 ►
Scan, scan, nothing’s wrong.
00:39:14 ►
Well, so I get into this loop, and as I analyzed it later, what was happening was that short-term memory was just not transcribing into RNA.
00:39:30 ►
It just was screwed up.
00:39:32 ►
It wasn’t working.
00:39:34 ►
So I knew who I was.
00:39:37 ►
I knew my whole life history.
00:39:40 ►
But the last three minutes were a complete blank.
00:39:47 ►
And this caused great anxiety.
00:39:50 ►
And I kept trying to go back to it.
00:39:52 ►
And I couldn’t get it.
00:39:54 ►
And I had the image, remember that scene in 2001
00:39:58 ►
where the guy is lured outside the ship in the little fix-it robot?
00:40:07 ►
And then he goes to go in, and he says,
00:40:09 ►
open the pod doors, Hal.
00:40:13 ►
And it says, I can’t do that, Dave.
00:40:17 ►
And that was the image.
00:40:22 ►
I could almost see, with my hyperspacial vision, I could almost see the molecular machinery jammed.
00:40:28 ►
And it was jammed.
00:40:30 ►
There was a lock.
00:40:32 ►
And so I thought,
00:40:33 ►
who you’re going to call?
00:40:40 ►
And the panic was really, it was getting out of hand.
00:40:46 ►
I mean, it was becoming engulfing.
00:40:48 ►
I could feel core processes beginning to disintegrate in the adrenaline that was being pumped into the system.
00:40:56 ►
And finally, I just said, I am, I will not move.
00:41:02 ►
I will not move.
00:41:03 ►
And I felt completely insane. I mean, I said, this is what madness is like.
00:41:10 ►
This is what the people who sit in the corner who scream once every three hours for the next 30 years.
00:41:17 ►
This is the kind of place they must go to. I’m just going to, I’m just going to ride this out, and I’m just going to sit here, and I’m not
00:41:26 ►
going to ask for help. I can’t even ask for help, because I can’t remember what the problem is.
00:41:35 ►
You know, I kept losing it. I didn’t lose the anxiety, but I kept losing what it was that
00:41:41 ►
was causing the anxiety. So I just deep breathe, deep breathe, deep breathe,
00:41:46 ►
watch it, and after about 45 minutes,
00:41:49 ►
I saw this molecular complex dextro rotate itself in space
00:41:56 ►
and break apart.
00:41:58 ►
And it was like, all right, back to just being loaded.
00:42:04 ►
Good, good. just being loaded.
00:42:09 ►
Good, good. This is good.
00:42:20 ►
And so I’m very, there’s not money in this end of the universe to pay me to do that combination again. Now, my advice to people is I think my mistake was if you’re going to do that,
00:42:28 ►
if you’re going to take an M.A.O. inhibitor with psilocybin, take like half a standard
00:42:36 ►
dose of psilocybin, but very little M.A.O. My mistake was I did a 50-50 and it should
00:42:43 ►
have been like a 70,10 or an 80-20.
00:42:50 ►
Well, that’s impossible to answer because ayahuasca is made by some…
00:42:56 ►
Well, my ayahuasca is 100 milliliters.
00:43:04 ►
I brew it to 100 milliliters,
00:43:07 ►
and that’s a design dose designed for me.
00:43:11 ►
But when you just buy a bottle
00:43:14 ►
or go with some guy into the woods,
00:43:17 ►
it could be anything.
00:43:19 ►
They can make it so that 30 milliliters is devastating,
00:43:24 ►
and sometimes they give you an 8-ounce glass
00:43:27 ►
that looks like dishwater,
00:43:29 ►
and you drink the entire thing, and nothing happens.
00:43:32 ►
So a thing to be aware of about ayahuasca is it is a drug
00:43:37 ►
as opposed to a plant.
00:43:40 ►
And what I mean by that is it’s made from plants,
00:43:44 ►
but it’s made by a human being.
00:43:48 ►
Mushrooms, you pick, cannabis, you pick, peyote, Iboga, you just gather and take.
00:43:55 ►
Iowaska, there’s a human being in there, the person who made it, and they can make it badly or well.
00:44:03 ►
And of course, in the Amazon, where money is tight
00:44:07 ►
and every gringo is rich,
00:44:11 ►
they have a bottle and they want 300 solace for it,
00:44:16 ►
but it doesn’t take them long to figure that if they cut it 50% with water,
00:44:21 ►
they’d have two bottles, and they could sell them each for 300 solace so
00:44:26 ►
in the tendency is to get weak stuff rather than strong stuff but if you’re brewing your own
00:44:33 ►
or making analogs you know there are old psychedelic explorers and there are bold
00:44:41 ►
psychedelic explorers but there are no old bold psychedelic explorers, but there are no old, bold psychedelic explorers.
00:44:48 ►
Actually, that’s not true.
00:44:49 ►
I think psychedelic voyaging is pretty physically safe.
00:44:55 ►
It’s the mind that is at risk,
00:44:58 ►
and that’s a much more imponderable issue.
00:45:02 ►
What’s the most of the short-term memory? It’s a long on the fact of short-term memory.
00:45:06 ►
It’s a long-term effect on short-term memory.
00:45:08 ►
Like of cannabis or something?
00:45:12 ►
Mushrooms, particularly.
00:45:13 ►
Oh, I’m sure that’s never been studied.
00:45:16 ►
That’s a kind of question
00:45:18 ►
in a sane society
00:45:20 ►
you would answer by having
00:45:22 ►
people do medical research.
00:45:23 ►
But in our society, you can think of a thousand questions like that
00:45:28 ►
that could be answered with clinical trials and medical research,
00:45:33 ►
but we don’t know.
00:45:34 ►
As far as the effects of cannabis on short-term memory,
00:45:40 ►
I just, you know, I smoke more cannabis than anyone I’ve ever known,
00:45:46 ►
and I have a better memory than anyone I’ve ever met.
00:45:49 ►
Maybe that’s not true, but the first statement is…
00:45:57 ►
Do you notice, like, following a mushroom trip, simple things,
00:46:03 ►
like in the parking lot,
00:46:06 ►
you have no idea that he’s been able to buy your car.
00:46:09 ►
Which side?
00:46:10 ►
No, dude.
00:46:11 ►
No!
00:46:13 ►
You see bed on my memory where my car is.
00:46:16 ►
Yellowly hatched.
00:46:17 ►
There, I know you have to wear a car.
00:46:19 ►
I really don’t think…
00:46:24 ►
I think these things are very, very safe,
00:46:27 ►
and the strange thing about them,
00:46:30 ►
and this is a challenge to each and every one of us,
00:46:34 ►
is that the strongest ones,
00:46:39 ►
the most terrifying ones,
00:46:42 ►
are the safest of all.
00:46:52 ►
And the extreme example being DMT. I mean, DMT is absolutely appalling. If you have a brain cell working and that doesn’t cause you to go into an absolute
00:46:59 ►
swive it, then you’re just not with it as far as I can tell, but it only lasts five minutes.
00:47:10 ►
And that’s a very strong indication to a pharmacologist or a clinician that your brain knows
00:47:18 ►
exactly what to do with this. It latches onto it, and in under five minutes, it reduces
00:47:24 ►
it to indolacetic acid.
00:47:27 ►
Fifteen minutes after you’ve smoked DMT, you cannot detect the drug in your system at all.
00:47:38 ►
In other words, you don’t have a headache. You don’t feel like you need to take a walk or
00:47:43 ►
lay down. It’s gone.
00:47:46 ►
It’s like pitching an ice cube into a blast furnace.
00:47:49 ►
It just is instantly taken away.
00:47:54 ►
Now, if you take a drug like ketamine, for example,
00:47:59 ►
48 hours later, you know, your knees are rubbery, your mind is wandering,
00:48:07 ►
and LSD can be fairly abrasive,
00:48:10 ►
meaning that long after the trip,
00:48:14 ►
you still haven’t turned on your answering machine,
00:48:16 ►
you’re still lying in warm baths,
00:48:20 ►
and you’re still just kind of, whoa, wow.
00:48:30 ►
That’s an indication of a of a not entirely benign relationship between the drug and your and your physiology so and you know the fact that
00:48:37 ►
dm t occurs naturally in the human brain for reasons we don’t understand i think it drives
00:48:44 ►
dreaming that’s my supposition when you give dmt to somebody and you and you want to for reasons we don’t understand. I think it drives dreaming.
00:48:46 ►
That’s my supposition. When you give DMT to somebody
00:48:48 ►
and you want to tell
00:48:50 ►
whether they are really getting off,
00:48:54 ►
the way to tell a person lies back
00:48:57 ►
and they usually lie still
00:48:59 ►
or perhaps they groan a little and twist.
00:49:02 ►
But the way to tell if they really have arrived
00:49:05 ►
is look at their closed eyes.
00:49:08 ►
And their eyes will be moving back and forth rapidly.
00:49:12 ►
They will be reming.
00:49:13 ►
It essentially plunges you into very, very deep rim.
00:49:18 ►
And you know how you can be having a deep rem dream
00:49:23 ►
and then like the phone rings. And so you jump out of bed and stagger over to the telephone and by the time you get to the phone you cannot remember anything about this dream it’s like it just it melts it literally melts away well that’s how DMT leaves your system exactly like that. At the height of the DMT, you are totally convinced that no one could live to tell this tale.
00:49:55 ►
And in a sense, you’re right, because as you come down, you can’t say what it was.
00:50:04 ►
As you come down, you can’t say what it was.
00:50:06 ►
Ten minutes after it happens,
00:50:12 ►
most people can only say it was the weirdest fucking thing that ever happened.
00:50:13 ►
The hyper-spatial payoff,
00:50:14 ►
the thing you really learn at the center of the DMT flash
00:50:21 ►
is the hyperspacial truth of your circumstance in being and that is so appalling
00:50:30 ►
that your only possible response to that data is to wipe it immediately saying okay now i know the truth
00:50:39 ►
now take it away yeah but i’m not sure it’s negative.
00:50:46 ►
I think it’s simply so huge
00:50:49 ►
and the implication is so vast
00:50:52 ►
and so dizzying
00:50:53 ►
that it can’t be folded up
00:50:56 ►
into this space.
00:50:58 ►
I mean, I’ve spent years
00:50:59 ►
trying to say what happens
00:51:02 ►
inside the DMT thing
00:51:03 ►
and I’ve gotten together a strange story,
00:51:06 ►
which I’m sure most of you have heard,
00:51:08 ►
but that isn’t what happens.
00:51:12 ►
That’s just the wildest story I could possibly conceive.
00:51:19 ►
It’s in the archaicry volume.
00:51:21 ►
About the self-transforming elf machines,
00:51:23 ►
the visible speech, the self-transforming elf machines the visible the visible speech the
00:51:28 ►
the self-dribling basketball well the the strange thing about DMT or the
00:51:36 ►
impression that I bring away from it and I had to do it many times to have any
00:51:40 ►
picture at all the first half a dozen times I did it I just couldn’t say a thing
00:51:46 ►
but I it drove me bananas I mean I just for me it was like hitting the main thing
00:51:52 ►
it’s like the thing that you have spent your entire life slowly accepting is impossible
00:52:01 ►
then it happens you know and you’ve spent your entire life
00:52:06 ►
like you can remember back into childhood,
00:52:09 ►
you knew this, but your whole life
00:52:12 ►
has been a moving away from it, a denying it,
00:52:16 ►
a convincing yourself, a slow acceptance
00:52:19 ►
that that couldn’t be, and then you say,
00:52:22 ►
my God, you know, the universe is made of magic top to
00:52:28 ►
bottom side to side it isn’t everything we thought was wrong our wildest dreams are as
00:52:36 ►
nothing compared to this thing that’s why you know the end of the world and all that you know
00:52:42 ►
you don’t have to wait around until 2012.
00:52:46 ►
I mean, just smoke some DMT, and you will discover that this universe you are living in
00:52:52 ►
is so much more bizarre than your wildest conception, and acid doesn’t prepare you.
00:53:00 ►
Nothing prepares you.
00:53:02 ►
I mean, this is truly, truly, truly the big surprise. And yet I also have a feeling that, you know, it’s very close to who we are. We produce it in our brain. If yoga is worth anything, it ought to be able to raise the endogenous concentration of a natural metabolite. So there ought to be a way to touch that place
00:53:28 ►
it’s been studied in cerebrospinal fluid and it’s known that the DMT reaches a peak in a
00:53:35 ►
circadian rhythm around 4 a.m. in most people that’s when the deep REM dreaming is going on
00:53:42 ►
you know from anthropology done on the Australian Aborigines
00:53:48 ►
that their whole cosmos is built around something called
00:53:53 ►
the dream time or the dreaming.
00:53:57 ►
Well, of course, with our cultural bias
00:53:59 ►
toward materialism and matter,
00:54:01 ►
this is precisely the kind of thing that would slip past us.
00:54:06 ►
But, you know, I think in a sense, hyperspace and the realm of dreams are the same thing.
00:54:14 ►
And it may be that the dear departed are there.
00:54:19 ►
I mean, this all is tied up with death in some profound way and you know it’s not the cheerful
00:54:29 ►
scenarios of the enthusiasts of near-death experiences you know the tunnel the
00:54:35 ►
beckoning friends and parents from Chuck it’s much weirder than that in fact it
00:54:43 ►
but but there there is a flavor of coming home,
00:54:49 ►
but this is a home you’ve been away from so long
00:54:53 ►
that until you lay eyes on it,
00:54:55 ►
you have completely forgotten it.
00:54:58 ►
And then when you do lay eyes on it,
00:55:00 ►
you realize, oh my God, you know,
00:55:04 ►
I forgot that I was this. I forgot that I came from here.
00:55:10 ►
And it doesn’t look like the cartography of ordinary mysticism. In other words, the spiritual,
00:55:20 ►
whatever that means in this hellish age, the spiritual people are always talking about unities.
00:55:29 ►
You know, the white light, the Shuniatah,
00:55:32 ►
the great dissolving, the great enveloping.
00:55:36 ►
It’s all tense toward neoplatonic metaphysics.
00:55:40 ►
That’s not what it is.
00:55:42 ►
It’s a universe.
00:55:44 ►
It seems to have everything in it. It is not the quite light. It’s
00:55:50 ►
multicolored, multi-dimensional, multi-everything. And somehow the way this hits you is like orgasm of some sort. I used to say that it was like an orgasm of beauty,
00:56:08 ►
or it was like a Niagara of beauty.
00:56:12 ►
But strange beauty, that’s the thing.
00:56:16 ►
Not simply the beautiful as we know it carried out to some ultimate completion,
00:56:23 ►
but alien beauty. But, but well there just aren’t words to
00:56:30 ►
tell I mean language fails it may be that the purpose of language is to describe
00:56:37 ►
this and yet language is entirely inadequate to it and you know we’re talking
00:56:43 ►
about something that’s three to four toks away from where
00:56:47 ►
you’re sitting.
00:56:49 ►
You don’t have to go to India and put up with all that filth and rabble and, you know, and you don’t
00:56:58 ►
have to submit yourself to some egomaniac and clean up after him and him.
00:57:03 ►
You don’t have to
00:57:05 ►
and it is not a moral
00:57:08 ►
issue. It isn’t
00:57:10 ►
only for the good
00:57:11 ►
it’s for everybody
00:57:13 ►
and the nearness of it
00:57:15 ►
is absolutely confounding.
00:57:18 ►
I mean here we live in an age
00:57:19 ►
of spiritual hunger
00:57:21 ►
where there isn’t a
00:57:23 ►
screwball notion you can come up with that you can’t get
00:57:27 ►
500 people to give you $50 to learn the details. And yet this thing is among us and absolutely
00:57:39 ►
authentic. And yet somehow it doesn’t behave like a substance in the sense of why don’t we make a metric ton of it and deal it in the underground like we do everything else well the answer seems to be this is like a substance which can control its own destiny so in a sense to hear about it is to fall under its sway. You can hear about it
00:58:11 ►
and just say, well, this guy said this thing, I don’t know, some crazy shit, I just didn’t forget it.
00:58:17 ►
But having heard about it, it enters your existence. And if you pursue it to impact, you then join those who know,
00:58:31 ►
and those who know can’t say very much about it.
00:58:35 ►
There’s a wonderful story.
00:58:41 ►
It’s actually, it actually only three pages long,
00:58:45 ►
and you should read this book anyway.
00:58:48 ►
Many of you have, I’m sure,
00:58:49 ►
Labyrinths by Jorge Louis Borges.
00:58:52 ►
But there’s a story in labyrinths
00:58:54 ►
called The Sect of the Phoenix,
00:58:57 ►
and it lasts, it’s about two pages long,
00:58:59 ►
and it goes something like this.
00:59:01 ►
It says, there is a thing,
00:59:09 ►
and the adepts who know of it have been members of every persecuted minority in history. And the adepts who know of it have been
00:59:17 ►
the persecutors of every minority in history. It knows no boundaries of geography race or language one
00:59:31 ►
child may initiate another doorways and ruins are propitious places the
00:59:40 ►
adept do not speak of it and when they do speak of it it’s always with embarrassment and slight
00:59:49 ►
deprecation it is orange and it goes on and on like this I don’t know who Jorge Louis
00:59:58 ►
Borges is but his read some of his other stories I mean this was definitely ahead of some
01:00:04 ►
sort but there it is and it’s been in all times and places you it’s it’s read some of his other stories. I mean, this was definitely ahead of some sort.
01:00:06 ►
But there it is.
01:00:09 ►
And it’s been in all times and places.
01:00:12 ►
It could have been extracted from plants as early as dynastic Egypt.
01:00:15 ►
It’s a companion to our journey through history.
01:00:20 ►
And it’s seen, you know, I said nothing is unanticipated.
01:00:25 ►
DMT is the first trump of judgment.
01:00:30 ►
And, you know, don’t believe me.
01:00:35 ►
Check it out.
01:00:35 ►
That’s the other thing.
01:00:36 ►
The great thing I love about being who I am is that I don’t rest on, I mean, yes, the mathematics and all that,
01:00:45 ►
but you can pass over that.
01:00:47 ►
You don’t need that.
01:00:48 ►
There are no guru, no method, no teacher,
01:00:53 ►
just you and that little glass pipe in the garden,
01:00:57 ►
in the garden, wet with rain.
01:01:01 ►
And that’s it.
01:01:02 ►
That’s the teaching.
01:01:03 ►
And it doesn’t require moral
01:01:06 ►
activity sexual activity you don’t have to give me all your money you don’t have
01:01:10 ►
to do anything just now you’ve heard it now you know and you know what you do
01:01:17 ►
with that is is your own business but there are doorways in this world that
01:01:22 ►
swing open on unimaginable abysses.
01:01:26 ►
And that’s one of them.
01:01:28 ►
Yes, you’ve been very patient.
01:01:30 ►
Do you think that smoking Viency is a good way to compare your consciousness
01:01:34 ►
for the higher vibrations that are out there?
01:01:37 ►
And that’s good enough?
01:01:39 ►
Well, it certainly shows you that you need to get a set of calisthenics together for your imagination.
01:01:48 ►
Yeah.
01:01:48 ►
I mean, some people say, well, does it help?
01:01:50 ►
Should we take something else first?
01:01:52 ►
And so forth and so on.
01:01:54 ►
I don’t think this has anything to do with that entire enterprise.
01:01:59 ►
I’ve given DMT to people who had never smoked pot,
01:02:06 ►
barely understood the concept of psychedelic drugs.
01:02:10 ►
I’ve given it to Tibetan llamas.
01:02:13 ►
I’ve given it to Kabbalists and Hasid.
01:02:17 ►
And it’s unspeakable.
01:02:21 ►
It shouldn’t exist.
01:02:23 ►
I mean, that was my impression. The first time I did it,
01:02:27 ►
I came down and I just was like I was pacing the floor. I was just right. And I said,
01:02:37 ►
I cannot believe it. I cannot believe it. I cannot believe that that is possible. I just can’t believe it. It’s absurd.
01:02:48 ►
It’s in fucking possible that such a thing could exist. The universe cares nothing for my opinion.
01:02:56 ►
It does exist. Yeah.
01:02:59 ►
I’ve seen the literature that there’s all first discoveries about their plant sources and
01:03:04 ►
the end of different varieties and so on.
01:03:08 ►
In your experience, are you aware of any particular solicitous routes to acquiring the
01:03:15 ►
problem is that you’re right.
01:03:18 ►
It occurs in a number of plants.
01:03:20 ►
In fact, it’s the most common psychedelic in nature but it never occurs in very great
01:03:27 ►
concentration so you always have the problem of bringing it forward into flashable material
01:03:35 ►
there are a whole bunch of grasses filaris tuberosa phileras aryramdenaceae i think the
01:03:42 ►
closest they’ve come is there is a strain of phalaris around anacee. I think the closest they’ve come is there is a strain of phalaris
01:03:48 ►
that some wheat breeders
01:03:50 ►
who were heads got hold of
01:03:52 ►
and they bred it for DMT
01:03:54 ►
and they had an analytical
01:03:56 ►
capacity so they could actually measure.
01:04:00 ►
And it’s known that when you grow
01:04:02 ►
little sprouts like bean sprouts
01:04:04 ►
and alfalfa sprouts,
01:04:05 ►
that they are most indole rich when they’re small.
01:04:11 ►
So what some people are doing is getting these really DMT-rich strains of Phalarasurundanasi
01:04:19 ►
and growing them in a sprout carousel, you know, one of those sprout growing systems
01:04:25 ►
that you can have by your sink in the kitchen,
01:04:28 ►
and then drying the sprouts,
01:04:32 ►
and a whole huge fistful of sprouts like this,
01:04:36 ►
of wet sprouts,
01:04:37 ►
will dry down to just a very light, weight,
01:04:41 ►
tangle of very hair-like material, and then you can just powder it between your fingers
01:04:48 ►
and put it in a big glass pipe and heat it and volatileize that stuff off but i i think you should
01:04:59 ►
try to get the pure chemical simply because I really am frustrated when people miss it.
01:05:08 ►
And it is possible to miss it in the sense that, and this is good advice,
01:05:14 ►
the way to do DMT, the cardinal rule is after you feel completely weird,
01:05:24 ►
you have to do one more hit.
01:05:28 ►
And that rule, some people can’t follow it because they’re, first of all,
01:05:38 ►
they’re quaking in their booths.
01:05:41 ►
And as they feel this sort of anesthetic this thing spread through their body they say wait
01:05:49 ►
I want to see what’s going to happen because it’s really coming on strong say no dude one
01:05:57 ►
more and right now and then follow it over the top because Because if you stop short, what happens is you see all these hallucinations like on a normal psychedelic.
01:06:12 ►
And then there’s a kind of a membrane.
01:06:17 ►
I call it the chrysanthemum because it looks like a chrysanthemum.
01:06:22 ►
It’s orange and it’s a big petal kind of thing and it’s like a membrane
01:06:27 ►
you come up against it and if you don’t have enough you will actually fall back and then you say
01:06:36 ►
well i don’t you know there was some kind there were colors and it was weird and i felt weird
01:06:43 ►
and that’s not it if they don’t come back clawing the air
01:06:47 ►
and hysterical then they didn’t do enough
01:06:50 ►
the true Voyager
01:06:54 ►
loses his cool
01:06:56 ►
that’s a good symptom that it worked
01:07:01 ►
but if you have enough
01:07:03 ►
when this chrysanthemum forms,
01:07:06 ►
you know, you just take a deep…
01:07:07 ►
And then it just like it hits you from behind,
01:07:10 ►
and it just pushes you through
01:07:12 ►
and into this sort of like a tunnel
01:07:17 ►
or sort of like it’s hard to describe,
01:07:20 ►
but it’s like a space
01:07:21 ►
where the ceiling and the floor
01:07:24 ►
can suddenly move up together and touch. And where they touch, it’s like they touch, it’s like a space where the ceiling and the floor can suddenly move up together and touch.
01:07:28 ►
And where they touch, it’s like they adhere.
01:07:31 ►
And there’s this and it opens and you fall, you like tumble into it.
01:07:40 ►
Well, then there’s a series of these dic systolic movements forward where it goes,
01:07:49 ►
and it’s like you’re coming down a kind of a ramp.
01:07:52 ►
And then what happens to me,
01:07:54 ►
and I’ve talked to a lot of people,
01:07:57 ►
and I think everybody goes to the same place,
01:07:59 ►
but they bring different impressions out of it.
01:08:02 ►
But it’s a place, not greatly larger than this room and with a
01:08:09 ►
somewhat low domed ceiling and somehow you know although it’s very hard to say how you know this
01:08:17 ►
that it’s far underground there’s a feeling of enormous weight above you and of great solidity around you.
01:08:28 ►
And you’re in this room.
01:08:30 ►
It’s softly lit and the walls are moving and everything is crawling with geometric hallucination and so forth and so on.
01:08:39 ►
But the main thing is the entities.
01:08:42 ►
It’s an inhabited mind space. It is crowded with intelligence,
01:08:48 ►
and these things come scrambling forward, like badly trained Rottweilers or something.
01:08:57 ►
And it comes bounding forward, and they crawl not only over you, but into you. And so you’re like, and the amazing thing about DMT is, unlike many drugs,
01:09:10 ►
you do not lose any fear or you don’t have a, you’re who you are.
01:09:18 ►
You could almost say it doesn’t affect you.
01:09:21 ►
It doesn’t affect your ego.
01:09:23 ►
It doesn’t affect your ego. It doesn’t affect your ego. It doesn’t affect your powers of observation.
01:09:25 ►
It doesn’t affect your judgment, so you’re scared shitless by this time.
01:09:30 ►
And instead, it’s like, you know, this is a place.
01:09:34 ►
This is not a drug.
01:09:36 ►
This is a place.
01:09:37 ►
And these things come and you’re like,
01:09:40 ►
and you realize it’s stabilized.
01:09:50 ►
It’s not going away.
01:09:52 ►
And then these things, they love you
01:09:56 ►
or they are trying to reassure you.
01:10:00 ►
And then they have gifts.
01:10:04 ►
These things, which are like Fabriier eggs or cut diamonds with machines installed in them and liquid,
01:10:12 ►
these objects which are changing as you look at them, and they offer these things.
01:10:17 ►
You know, look at this, look at this, and they’re almost elbowing each other aside.
01:10:24 ►
Each one wants your full
01:10:26 ►
attention, and there are dozens of
01:10:28 ►
them clamoring and clamoring
01:10:30 ►
and you’re like, you know, and
01:10:31 ►
saying, don’t worry, don’t worry,
01:10:34 ►
and then pay attention, pay attention,
01:10:36 ►
and then a very odd
01:10:38 ►
message. They say, do
01:10:40 ►
not abandon yourself
01:10:42 ►
to amazement.
01:10:44 ►
You know, don’t just start screaming and carrying on about how you can’t believe it, and it’sazement. You know, don’t just start screaming and carrying on
01:10:47 ►
about how you can’t believe it and it’s so wonderful.
01:10:49 ►
You know, chill that.
01:10:52 ►
Pay attention.
01:10:54 ►
And then what they’re doing is they’re creating objects with sound.
01:11:00 ►
They’re speaking in a language that you can see and these things that are words
01:11:08 ►
but puns objects but sentences it’s though syntax and matter have become somehow
01:11:16 ►
commingled so they say look at this and they drop something into the air well then it’s
01:11:23 ►
singing it’s making objects.
01:11:26 ►
Objects are raining out of the sky,
01:11:29 ►
these metal, glass, diamond, gold things.
01:11:33 ►
And you’re trying to take all of this in
01:11:35 ►
and they say, you know, do what we are doing.
01:11:39 ►
That’s the idea.
01:11:41 ►
Do it!
01:11:42 ►
And, you know, you’re like,
01:11:44 ►
and then for a long time I just observe this
01:11:49 ►
but then finally and not entirely under my own control I realized you know that I had
01:11:55 ►
that there was a potential like a light or a bubble almost like a belch or something
01:12:02 ►
but something which wanted to move up and out, and you feel it,
01:12:06 ►
move up your chest and into your mouth, and then it just spills out, and you’re doing it.
01:12:13 ►
You’ve joined them.
01:12:15 ►
You’re what?
01:12:15 ►
And your sounds are creating.
01:12:18 ►
And you can see your language, and you slip into glossolalia you know and dig a
01:12:26 ►
wakchitchimic my kubov saying, yes, yes, that’s it.
01:12:54 ►
And about this time, it’s like, and they begin to move away. And in one of the trips, they even turned to me and said,
01:12:59 ►
Deja vu.
01:13:02 ►
Deja vu, deja vu, deja vu, Deja vu.
01:13:06 ►
And then it’s like, at that point, I tell people,
01:13:09 ►
you should open your eyes.
01:13:11 ►
When the hallucinations begin to fade, open your eyes.
01:13:15 ►
The reason for this is if you keep your eyes closed,
01:13:18 ►
everything gets ugly.
01:13:21 ►
It’s like melting snow.
01:13:23 ►
It’s like suddenly what you’re looking at is like a ditch
01:13:29 ►
somewhere with melting snow and kind of stuff. I say, yeah, it’s a hallucination. It’s ugly. It’s
01:13:36 ►
meaningless. What is it? So as soon as the hallucinations leave, get this electric immediacy gone.
01:13:44 ►
You just open your eyes.
01:13:46 ►
And then it’s like you’re on a thousand mics of acid or something,
01:13:50 ►
but it’s so familiar that you just embrace it as reality and say,
01:13:55 ►
I’m back, I’m down.
01:13:57 ►
My God, what was that?
01:14:00 ►
And then over the next four or five minutes,
01:14:03 ►
you actually, through a series of quantized retractions from it, pull together.
01:14:10 ►
And five minutes later, you’re saying, damnedest thing I ever saw.
01:14:19 ►
Yeah.
01:14:20 ►
Do you have any experiences of, like, your jaw or your ears or your eyes or any types of, like, experiences of cracking in your body
01:14:28 ►
where your body actually physically changes as you enter into new realm?
01:14:32 ►
Well, it’s interesting you put it that way.
01:14:34 ►
I hadn’t thought of it as in the body.
01:14:36 ►
There is a sound as you go into it,
01:14:38 ►
which sounds like somebody taking a piece of plastic bread wrapper
01:14:43 ►
and crinkling it, or flames, a crackling
01:14:47 ►
cellophane-like sound.
01:14:50 ►
And I said to, I asked somebody what this was, not that they knew and I didn’t, but what’s
01:14:56 ►
your opinion?
01:14:57 ►
This guy said, oh, it’s the radio intellect key, leaving the Ontario Fontenelle at the top
01:15:02 ►
of your head.
01:15:04 ►
It’s actually the envelope of the body being ripped in hyperspace
01:15:08 ►
as this thing leaves you.
01:15:12 ►
I don’t know.
01:15:17 ►
Anyway, it’s been great spending time with you.
01:15:22 ►
And, you know, the idea is to keep your mind open your system open
01:15:28 ►
your wallet closed and just soldier forward into the future which holds i think enormous promise
01:15:42 ►
and opportunity for all of us.
01:15:49 ►
It’s where we’re going to spend the rest of our lives before the Eschaton.
01:15:59 ►
And the purpose of all of this, I think, is to assuage anxiety.
01:16:03 ►
As we get closer and closer to the Eschaton,
01:16:09 ►
people are going, there’s going to be a lot of panic, uncertainty, unhappiness,
01:16:20 ►
because though everything in the world is going to change, nothing will survive in recognizable form into the new modality.
01:16:28 ►
And this is good news, but it may be taken for bad news. And the task of psychedelic people, I think, is to act as midwives for this collective birthing of a new ontos of being
01:16:38 ►
that is going to rend the shell of three-dimensional space and time and create a new level of novelty and
01:16:48 ►
organization in the universe, as has happened so many, many times before. But this is the first
01:16:57 ►
time that human beings will be witnesses to and participators in the action
01:17:06 ►
at least since the invention
01:17:08 ►
of language
01:17:09 ►
so you know
01:17:10 ►
keep your powder dry
01:17:12 ►
and
01:17:13 ►
you’re rear well protected
01:17:16 ►
and I’ll see you
01:17:19 ►
if not before
01:17:20 ►
at the end of the world
01:17:22 ►
thank you very much
01:17:24 ►
as we just heard at the end of the world. Thank you very much.
01:17:29 ►
As we just heard,
01:17:31 ►
one of the most common questions that was asked of Terrence
01:17:33 ►
was what happens after December 21st, 2012.
01:17:37 ►
And it certainly was my first question
01:17:39 ►
after hearing about the time wave.
01:17:41 ►
But no matter what you think about Terrence
01:17:43 ►
and his time wave idea,
01:17:45 ►
my guess is that it at least got you to thinking about a lot of things that you hadn’t thought
01:17:50 ►
of in the same way before, like the nature of time and of the perhaps insurmountable
01:17:55 ►
difficulties encountered in time travel. At least, I hope that this talk has planted a few
01:18:01 ►
new ideas in your mind, as it has for me.
01:18:09 ►
And for now, this is Lorenzo, signing off from Cyberdelic Space.
00:00:00 ►
Namaste, my friend. Into the light, into the light, into the light of bare naked truth.