Program Notes
Guest speaker: Terence McKenna
[NOTE: All quotations are by Terence McKenna.]
“You don’t conquer time by building vast instrumentalities and seeking a primary particle and all that. The way you understand and investigate time is by moving inward, into metabolism. The human body is a knot in time.”
“I live in a kind of waking hallucination. I have a little aphorism which covers this. It’s: Rome falls nine times an hour. It falls more than that and less than that, but let’s say it falls nine times an hour. Well, then your job is to notice every time it falls. In other words, what we think of as our random musings and our personal mental furniture is in fact our subconscious awareness of these systems of temporal resonance operating around us.” [Comment by Lorenzo: I have no idea what he means by this.]
“I do entertain the idea that we may each have our own Timewave, sort of following the model of astrology.”
“What will happen, as novelty asymptotically increases, in the final months, hours, minutes, seconds is boundaries will dissolve, all boundaries They’re already dissolving. We see the nation-state dissolving, but wait’ll the atomic field dissolves.”
“It’s not a gravity collapse. It’s a novelty collapse. We are collapsing into a black hole of novelty.”
“The future is not like the past except that it hasn’t happened. If you were to suddenly find yourself in the future, it’s a vector-storm of unrealized possibilities. You’ve never seen an unrealized possibility.”
“I believe that the idea that is the most fun is probably the closest to the truth, and I find this idea to be absolutely delightful.”
“The whole thing [Timewave hypothesis] smacks of the impossible. It’s even pushed me toward the idea that maybe this is not actually a reality. We’re trapped, or I’m trapped. I don’t know if you’re trapped. But we’re in some kind of piece of fiction. It’s like a Phillip K. Dick deal, you know. We’re in some kind of simulacrum, and the clue to the fact that it’s a simulacrum is this impossible idea [the Timewave]. And so the point of the idea is not to believe it, but to use it as a wedge to fight our way out of this labyrinth and back to whatever reality we were in before we fell into this situation. Something like that.”
Dustin Cantwell’s
Fane of the Cosmos
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204 - Appreciating Imagination – Part 4
Next Episode
206 - Appreciating Imagination – Part 6
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Transcript
00:00:00 ►
Greetings from cyberdelic space.
00:00:19 ►
This is Lorenzo, and I’m your host here in the psychedelic salon.
00:00:24 ►
And first off, I want to apologize for being away so long.
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It wasn’t anything serious, just a pesky head cold, but until last night…
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I sounded like this, and it didn’t seem like a good way to do a podcast.
00:00:40 ►
And so I thought it would be best to wait until I sounded a little bit less stuffed up.
00:00:45 ►
Although not much, I guess.
00:00:47 ►
But my delay in completing this McKenna series about imagination
00:00:51 ►
may be causing some consternation out in podcast land.
00:00:55 ►
Andy O., one of my Facebook friends, wrote to say,
00:00:59 ►
Hi Lorenzo, I’ve been listening to the latest McKenna series you’re podcasting.
00:01:03 ►
They’re some of my favorites so far.
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Can you tell me how many installments there will be in this series?
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Will they all be available before Christmas?
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The only reason I ask is that I would like to present them as a gift to a friend at Christmas.
00:01:16 ►
Well, Andy, I have some good news for you.
00:01:19 ►
This is the next to last installment of this series,
00:01:22 ►
and I’ll get the next one out this weekend, if all goes according to plan.
00:01:26 ►
And I agree with you that this series is one of the best.
00:01:30 ►
And we have fellow salonner Brian Pitkin
00:01:33 ►
to thank for sending this series of recordings to me to podcast.
00:01:37 ►
And additionally, I want to thank a whole bunch of people
00:01:40 ►
who made donations to the salon over these past two weeks,
00:01:43 ►
some of whom are also repeat donors to the salon. And these wonderful people are… Thank you. of the McKenna podcasts. And you can find those on our website, which you can reach through psychedelicsalon.org.
00:02:07 ►
So thank you for everything, Allison.
00:02:09 ►
And a huge thank you to Ido, John, Michelle, Mark, Paul, and David
00:02:13 ►
for your generosity and help in keeping these podcasts alive on the net.
00:02:19 ►
Now, on to today’s program,
00:02:22 ►
which is the next-to-last installment of a workshop that Terence McKenna held at the Esalen Institute here in California late in 1997.
00:02:31 ►
To be honest here, I almost skipped this section of the workshop due to my own personal prejudices.
00:02:37 ►
You see, the topic is Terence’s time wave hypothesis, which I must admit I’m no fan of.
00:02:45 ►
To me, it seems too much like a fortune-telling thing
00:02:49 ►
or some of the less informed approaches to astrology
00:02:52 ►
that try to predict the future rather than simply to suggest
00:02:56 ►
what energy patterns are prevalent at any given time.
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The other thing that bothered me about it is that
00:03:02 ►
in one of the earlier lectures we heard Terence give,
00:03:06 ►
he initially set the end date at 2011, only to adjust it later on. And of course, the 2011 date
00:03:14 ►
is one that Carl Kalamann also pursues, but although he refuses to let anybody see his
00:03:19 ►
calculations that led him to arrive at that date. But even though I didn’t really want to hear any more about the time wave,
00:03:27 ►
I went ahead and previewed this part of the workshop
00:03:29 ►
and discovered something new for me to think about in relation to this hypothesis.
00:03:35 ►
I’ll save my comments about it until after you hear this talk yourself,
00:03:39 ►
and then you’ll be better able to see where I’m coming from.
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So now let’s join Terrence McKenna and friends for a little ride on the time wave.
00:03:53 ►
So, this theory has probably not stormed the intellectual battlements of Western civilization,
00:04:03 ►
for one reason, because it poses so fundamental
00:04:07 ►
a challenge. Science cannot swallow the time wave. You have to choose one or the other.
00:04:15 ►
The time wave is not a cult. It is not a cult. But it is not science as we have done it for the past 500 years
00:04:25 ►
because it assumes that one of our primary intuitions is actually true,
00:04:33 ►
the intuition that every moment is unique.
00:04:37 ►
It treats that as the central starting point for an entirely new metaphysic of being. And so the smooth duration, the simple
00:04:49 ►
answer, the parsimonious good try has to be put aside. Now, why the I Ching? Because in the same way that Western culture evolved a maniacal obsession with matter that ends with atomic fusion, sequencing of the DNA, room temperature superconductors, Buckminster fulleren eanes and all that in the same way that
00:05:29 ►
Western intellectual methods were relentlessly pushed toward
00:05:36 ►
an understanding of matter in in the East a different obsession
00:05:42 ►
Held sway for cultural factors not needing to be discussed here
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People were interested not in matter but in time. The other great mystery given to us in this dimension, time. And if you’re
00:05:55 ►
interested in time, you don’t conquer time by building vast instrumentalities and seeking a primary particle and all that. The way
00:06:08 ►
you understand and investigate time is by moving inward into metabolism. The human It is a non-thermodynamic state of equilibrium maintained by the miracle of
00:06:31 ►
metabolism. Metabolism is a slow controlled chemical burning of organic material,
00:06:40 ►
so subtle a form of burning that the energy is trapped in various membranes and cytochrome
00:06:48 ►
cascades and and put to the work of
00:06:53 ►
organism and
00:06:55 ►
if you
00:06:58 ►
Imagine then at some time thousands of years in the past
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People Possessing techniques which today we would call yogic.
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But what they really are are simply probably what are now called
00:07:14 ►
spilling of the heart techniques,
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techniques for suppressing gross bodily function.
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In other words, noticeable breathing, noticeable heartbeat, noticeable pulse,
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techniques for stilling all this. It turns out that as if this can be done, and it is persistently
00:07:38 ►
claimed that it can be done, as noise leaves the physiological circuits and circuits,
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the mind falls inward into a world of interiorized phenomena
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for which we have no language but the language of idiots,
00:07:58 ►
because this is not our cultural obsession.
00:08:01 ►
So we say, well, it’s a dream, it’s a hallucination, it’s who knows,
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let’s see what’s going on
00:08:07 ►
with the 11 o’clock news.
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But in other cultures,
00:08:11 ►
complex vocabularies were produced
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to study these states.
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Vocabularies as complex as our scientific vocabularies.
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And in the same way that in the 19th century, Mendeleev and those people
00:08:27 ►
came to discern that all matter is produced out of the combination of a limited number of elements,
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and there were arguments about how much, how many, but it’s generally assumed under 110,
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how many, but it’s generally assumed under 110, and that’s generous. Out of 110 basic elements,
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the entire world of material phenomenon emerges. Similarly, in the inspection of time,
00:09:12 ►
it was realized that time too comes in flavors, if you will. Not 50,000, not 300 million, not 4, not 8, but 64.
00:09:16 ►
And this probably has to do something with the cube root of 4 and certain things having to do with the dimensionality in time and space.
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I mean, why this number is a reason for speculation.
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It’s a number built into biology, too.
00:09:30 ►
There are 64 codons coding for the eight amino acids.
00:09:35 ►
This is no coincidence.
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It’s something about the basic grammar of being itself
00:09:41 ►
arises around these numbers.
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Grammar of being itself arises around these numbers.
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Well, they not only saw that time is made of these elements, but they saw that they occurred in certain fixed patterns of recurrence
00:09:58 ►
at different levels, at different speeds,
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and that from the point of view of this I Ching philosophy, a given moment
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in being at some locus of space and time is a kind of interference pattern created by
00:10:19 ►
moving levels of, let us call them, influences.
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And these influences interpenetrate each other on many levels.
00:10:37 ►
And all of this can, in fact, be quantified and mathematicized and portrayed in the universal language of mathematics.
00:10:42 ►
And that’s what I’ve tried to do.
00:10:45 ►
I’m sorry this answer ran so long.
00:10:47 ►
But I want to make it seem reasonable to you
00:10:52 ►
that there are categories in time as well as in matter,
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and that if you can discern these categories,
00:11:01 ►
you can gain as powerful an intellectual understanding of time as we have
00:11:07 ►
of matter. Now let me get back to how this thing is read, and then I want to move forward here.
00:11:14 ►
When the wave moves up, habit is increasing. When the wave moves dramatically down, novelty is increasing. And time on all scales is made out of a sense into habit,
00:11:31 ►
plunges into novelty, novelty troughs, and further ascents into habit. And you can feel these things
00:11:39 ►
in your own life. When the luck is running with you, nothing can stop you. When the wave is against
00:11:45 ►
you, God help you. And this happens to empires. It happens to political careers. It happens to
00:11:52 ►
species. It happens to entire orders of biological life, a hundred million years of endless radiation
00:12:00 ►
into all kinds of niches across the planet, then suddenly a planetary cooling and
00:12:07 ►
a mass extinction and the novel forms or disappear. But over long periods of time, as I said,
00:12:18 ►
habit is vanquished and novelty is concentrated. And that’s part of the story, half of the story.
00:12:29 ►
The other half of the story is that this process of movement into deeper novelty is speeding up,
00:12:48 ►
speeding up, always has been speeding up, goes faster and faster and faster. So if this is seven billion years, you can see back here things were deadly slow.
00:12:57 ►
Here, life appears.
00:13:00 ►
Once life appears, the pace quickens.
00:13:03 ►
Once life appears, the pace quickens.
00:13:13 ►
Once life leaves the ocean, at this scale, the thing is practically a direct descent into novelty.
00:13:28 ►
Though when we blow this up, as we can do, we will see that what looks here like a smooth, straight shot into the lap of God, turns out to be the old rugged path that we followed for a long, long time.
00:13:32 ►
Every theory has a hard swallow.
00:13:35 ►
The hard swallow in ordinary science is the Big Bang.
00:13:41 ►
Notice that it’s the limit test for credulity.
00:13:44 ►
If you can believe that the entire universe sprang from nothing in a single instant for
00:13:51 ►
no reason, what would you resist as a hypothesis?
00:13:57 ►
It’s the limit case for improbability, as far as I can tell.
00:14:03 ►
for improbability, as far as I can tell.
00:14:06 ►
Nevertheless, science says, you know,
00:14:08 ►
give us one free miracle,
00:14:11 ►
and we can then go from there and never ask the favor again.
00:14:14 ►
So apparently you get one free miracle
00:14:17 ►
in your system building.
00:14:21 ►
I prefer to locate my miracle at the end.
00:14:27 ►
And you may say, well, is that just arbitrary?
00:14:30 ►
Why December 21st, 2012?
00:14:33 ►
Well, obviously, if the theory has any utility,
00:14:39 ►
if this idea of habit and novelty has any instructive value at all,
00:14:46 ►
then we should find novel events clustered in these troughs,
00:14:53 ►
and we should find periods of constipated recidivism on these upsweeps.
00:15:00 ►
So now we have two data fields with which to play. We have the formal and mathematically
00:15:07 ►
defined and utterly inflexible wave, and we have the vicissitudes of natural and human history.
00:15:17 ►
On the natural history level, asteroid impacts, glaciations, extinctions,
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fluctuations in incidental
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incoming solar energy,
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cooling of the oceans,
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enormous volcanic eruption,
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this sort of thing,
00:15:34 ►
in the human world,
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wars, revolutions,
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technological innovations,
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migrations of people,
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introductions of new technologies.
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And so the idea then is to take the mathematically defined wave
00:15:50 ►
and the admittedly messy data of natural and human history
00:15:56 ►
and seek a best fit between them.
00:16:00 ►
And when you impartially get them lined up so that it seems that most major episodes of
00:16:12 ►
novelty that historians or people who care about these things agree on, and most low points in the
00:16:21 ►
wave line up with each other, then you simply go to the end of the wave and look at
00:16:27 ►
the end point and it kicks out a date. And I did this, and I will show you my correlations.
00:16:35 ►
As a big picture, I think this is pretty accurate to how most educated historians would view what has gone on on this planet in the last 6,000 years.
00:16:48 ►
It’s telling us that 4500 BC, a descent into novelty is underway, and it didn’t start very
00:16:58 ►
far back here, quite a steep descent into novelty. And in fact, what we find here is Sumer, Ur, Chaldea, Babylon, Egypt.
00:17:16 ►
And so a series of civilizations,
00:17:19 ►
each leaping beyond the accomplishments of the other
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until we reach the pyramid building phase
00:17:27 ►
of Egypt, the old kingdom. And then right down here, there’s a kind of novelty trough.
00:17:37 ►
Egyptian civilization rages across here. And in fact, it does fulfill the intuition of theosophists and other people
00:17:47 ►
that Egypt achieved something that was not surpassed in novelty until early Roman times.
00:17:58 ►
In other words, clear all this happens, but you don’t get this level of novelty until you get over here to about 220 BC.
00:18:07 ►
And I maintain, technologically and so forth and so on, that’s probably just about right.
00:18:14 ►
This upswing back into habit, the historical record is characterized by brutal civilizations.
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The Hittites, the Mitanni, Imperial Assyria,
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you know, motorcycle gangs with chariots
00:18:34 ►
is what we’re talking about here.
00:18:37 ►
If we were to blow this up,
00:18:39 ►
we would see that there were some interesting plunges
00:18:44 ►
into novelty,
00:18:46 ►
phonetic alphabets, expansion of Phoenician trade routes, and so forth and so on.
00:18:50 ►
But the turning point is up here.
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And as far as Western history is concerned,
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what happens up here is Homer sings his song.
00:19:03 ►
And I maintain, symbolically and literally,
00:19:07 ►
that’s what started it all.
00:19:10 ►
That’s what set the last phase in motion.
00:19:15 ►
I had a professor, maybe I’m echoing his prejudice,
00:19:18 ►
but a philosophy professor in college,
00:19:21 ►
and he said, you want to know where it all went wrong?
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I’ll tell you where it all went wrong? I’ll tell
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you where it all went wrong. When the Greeks stopped being fishermen and pulled their boats
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up on the shore and started to talk philosophy, it all went wrong. Well, I don’t know if it went
00:19:39 ►
wrong. It certainly went in a different direction. Homer sings his song,
00:19:50 ►
and it begins an almost unbroken cascade into modernity.
00:19:53 ►
I want to talk about this one for a minute because there is an aspect of this theory
00:19:55 ►
that I find very appealing that I haven’t touched on yet,
00:19:59 ►
which is, if you’ve been paying attention,
00:20:02 ►
you’ve noticed that screens repeat themselves.
00:20:06 ►
Remember I showed you a screen where I said at the top of a certain mountain,
00:20:11 ►
Homer sang his song?
00:20:14 ►
This is that same shape.
00:20:16 ►
But we’re now not looking at thousands of years.
00:20:20 ►
We’re only looking at 52 years.
00:20:23 ►
Well, what’s the deal?
00:20:25 ►
Well, because this thing is a fractal, it has like in, built into it, automatic resonances.
00:20:37 ►
So it gives you a very rich data field to work with.
00:20:51 ►
you a very rich data field to work with. If this is a span of time from 1944 to 1996,
00:21:06 ►
it on another level is a span of time from roughly late Egyptian time to the Umayyad Caliphate, with Homer singing his song up here.
00:21:12 ►
On the short scale, the 52-year scale, this is 1967.
00:21:19 ►
Now, these two things are, according to this theory, in a situation of resonance or geometrical relationship to each other.
00:21:25 ►
Is there anything about the world of Homer that is like the world of 1967?
00:21:34 ►
And I maintain, yes, a tendency to easy lifestyles, loose shoes,
00:21:40 ►
and sophomoric philosophy characterized both theories.
00:21:44 ►
and sophomoric philosophy characterized both theories.
00:21:49 ►
And you see, it’s a way of explaining such transient phenomena as fads and fashion.
00:21:54 ►
Why are we suddenly putting lion claws
00:21:57 ►
on the legs of our bathtubs?
00:22:00 ►
Well, because we’re passing through a period of resonance
00:22:04 ►
when that was done in the past.
00:22:08 ►
In other words, the orthodox theories of history and time would tell you that the most important moment shaping this moment is the moment which just preceded this moment. It was, as it were, the conduit for the wave of causal necessity
00:22:29 ►
to arrive at this moment.
00:22:32 ►
But I’m saying something different.
00:22:34 ►
I’m saying that every moment in time is an interference pattern
00:22:40 ►
made by other moments in time that are related to each other, not through linear
00:22:47 ►
seriality, but through this much more complex scheme of relations. So, you know, if you suddenly
00:22:56 ►
walk into a room and there’s a heavy hit of black granite inverted corners and silver shadowing, it’s a
00:23:08 ►
Jugendstil resonance. And I live in a kind of waking hallucination. I have a
00:23:16 ►
little aphorism which covers this. It’s Rome falls nine times an hour.
00:23:29 ►
It falls more than that and less than that,
00:23:32 ►
but let’s say it falls nine times an hour.
00:23:36 ►
Well, then your job is to notice every time it falls.
00:23:41 ►
In other words, what we think of as our random musings and our personal mental furniture
00:23:45 ►
is in fact our subconscious awareness
00:23:49 ►
of these systems of temporal resonance operating around us.
00:23:54 ►
So, you know, as I look out at a crowd like this,
00:23:59 ►
if I let myself go, you know,
00:24:02 ►
I notice that Kant is sleeping in the corner and that Madame Lafarge
00:24:09 ►
seems to have just come in from the baths and taken her seat. And Cleopatra is headed for the so on. How real is this? Who knows? You know, I mean, it’s a matter of discernment, yes.
00:24:34 ►
Well, what I would say, I mean, first of all, let’s get a little more honest here. There’s a
00:24:42 ►
lot of argument about where Homer actually sang his song. We can
00:24:47 ►
only really pinpoint it to within about 150 years. It’s up here somewhere. Now, I could zero in on
00:24:58 ►
this, but 1967 is here. 1968 is just over the top. The first moon flight is there. Well, now, suddenly, we have the Homeric resonance. What is Homer but a story of noble men on a long and far voyage, and eventually the homeward return, and then the heroics of that echoes over the centuries.
00:25:26 ►
And probably the only heroic episode of the 20th century that’s unsullied by hypola and
00:25:35 ►
manipulation and so forth is the flight to the moon. I mean, that was pretty amazing. You know,
00:25:42 ►
I don’t care about the politics or any of the rest of it. I mean,
00:25:46 ►
what it took to do that, you notice we’re not doing it. We don’t have the gumption,
00:25:51 ►
the technology, or the national focus to do that. And in a sense, so I take the moon flight to be,
00:26:00 ►
in a sense, the capstone of modernism. I consider postmodern time to begin after that.
00:26:09 ►
I mean, what was the 70s but a whining reprise of the 60s, and then everything else has followed
00:26:18 ►
from that. Yeah.
00:26:19 ►
Shouldn’t it then be at a novelty stock?
00:26:27 ►
I myself am more provisional. I will advocate this, but I’m aware, more I think than many in my audience,
00:26:35 ►
how unlikely this is.
00:26:37 ►
I’m basically a devil’s advocate because I’m fascinated with the fact that I thought this up,
00:26:48 ►
and this is not my style. It’s hard for you to believe that, because I’ve been now talking about it since 1971. So it has become me, in a
00:26:57 ►
sense, but it isn’t me. This is not how I think. This is not how I ever thought. I had to be led by the hand. I’m sloppier than this.
00:27:08 ►
I’m not precise. This was told to me, and it’s eerie. It’s turned my life to science fiction,
00:27:19 ►
because I don’t know what this is all about. I don’t know why I’m here talking about this. I don’t know why
00:27:27 ►
you’re here listening to it. And I’m puzzled that outside this room, the world is moving
00:27:36 ►
towards not this theory, but these kinds of conclusions. Is it the millennium? Well, this isn’t about the millennium. This says
00:27:48 ►
forget the millennium. It’s a complete waste of time, a speed bump on the way to the real event.
00:27:55 ►
I’ve tried to think of rational explanations for why this theory, and I’ve had to go pretty far afield.
00:28:06 ►
Here’s a rational explanation.
00:28:08 ►
Suppose the millennium is so psychically charged
00:28:13 ►
that there’s a danger of mass hysteria of some sort,
00:28:18 ►
mass suicides or something like that.
00:28:20 ►
Perhaps the collective unconscious senses this, and my mission is to smear the expectation.
00:28:31 ►
In other words, what this does is it says, don’t get excited about the millennium.
00:28:37 ►
And then once the millennium is passed, people will say, well, and don’t worry about McKenna either. In other words, it’s a way of
00:28:47 ►
cheating you past the millennium. If there weren’t people running around saying 2012, 2010, 28, 26,
00:28:56 ►
2004, there would be so much energy concentrated on the millennium, that there might be various forms of mass hysteria.
00:29:05 ►
I mean, I don’t know, but it’s a more reasonable explanation
00:29:10 ►
than that the secret of universal temporal architectonics
00:29:16 ►
has been handed over to an Irishman by a mushroom for the edification of mankind.
00:29:24 ►
I mean, that is too much.
00:29:31 ►
I’m amazed that, because you see, it’s so precise.
00:29:37 ►
And I don’t know if you can tell from what I’ve said this evening,
00:29:43 ►
but it’s very clear to me that it’s not about being right some of the time.
00:29:49 ►
If it fails once, it fails completely.
00:29:56 ►
There’s no wiggle room.
00:29:59 ►
That’s why it’s so interesting to try to trap it.
00:30:02 ►
This is not something where if we get seven out of ten,
00:30:06 ►
we’re going to keep preaching. This thing must be right 10,000 times out of 10,000 tries.
00:30:14 ►
And as I offer it to you and to other people, because I think smarter people than me ought to be able to destroy it.
00:30:27 ►
You know, remember when I talked about how science gets points for, you get points for
00:30:33 ►
proving you’re wrong? If I could prove this was bunk, I would get a lot of points. If anybody could prove it was wrong, absolutely wrong, but it’s amazingly slippery.
00:30:51 ►
So slippery, in fact, that it’s almost like a living thing. Just when you think you’ve pushed
00:30:58 ►
it into a corner that it can’t escape from, you know, you get a Martian meteorite full of fossils right in your
00:31:05 ►
lap. So we’re struggling to say, you know, is this a message? Is this meaning? Or is
00:31:13 ►
this self-generated hallucination? I don’t know. I offer it as part of this weekend on imagination, because this is my best trick in the imagination.
00:31:31 ►
My little theory of evolution
00:31:34 ►
is no more than a conversational rap,
00:31:37 ►
a how would it be if.
00:31:39 ►
This is considerably different,
00:31:41 ►
because it rests on a mathematical foundation. And don’t forget,
00:31:48 ►
it does come genuinely from the I Ching. So we have this peculiar three-pronged situation.
00:31:58 ►
We have a pattern in the King Wen sequence taken by an Irishman and contorted into a
00:32:08 ►
mathematical wave which gives a prediction for the apotheosis of the
00:32:14 ►
world which matches the assumptions of a vanished Mesoamerican civilization. Huh? Why? Where does it end? Well, this question, when I calculate my own personal
00:32:33 ►
wave, first of all, I do entertain the idea that we may each have our own time wave,
00:32:42 ►
sort of following the model of astrology.
00:32:46 ►
But I’m aware, and I’m sure those of you who are professional astrologers are also aware,
00:32:51 ►
that the natal horoscope is essentially a commercial con.
00:32:58 ►
In other words, astrology, the royal art of astrology, was invented to guide the destiny of peoples and kings, pharaohs and courts.
00:33:10 ►
But in the late Roman period, the world’s first yuppies came into being, or one of the world’s first instances of yuppies.
00:33:21 ►
And they thought, well, the emperor has his horoscope cast. Am I less than the
00:33:27 ►
emperor? I too should have my horoscope cast. And enterprising Hellenistic astronomers were only too
00:33:36 ►
pleased to oblige. Otto Neugebauer published a wonderful book of the natal horoscopes of rich Athenian and Roman citizens.
00:33:48 ►
And to some degree, I think it is a slight distortion of astrology for astrological purposes.
00:33:59 ►
Nevertheless, in terms of the time wave, a reasonable question would be, well, how, if this is true, then how
00:34:07 ►
come I can have a bad day while you’re having a good day? In other words, if novelty ebbs and
00:34:14 ►
flows according to this schedule, shouldn’t we all be having good days and bad days together?
00:34:30 ►
together and obviously we don’t so what then must be happening is that we are on different places in the wave system and then if that’s true then in a sense this huge wave could be thought of as the summation of all the little waves which comprise it.
00:34:47 ►
It’s perfectly obvious. Let’s say this were a huge scale of time, several thousand years.
00:34:55 ►
Well, then this might be a period of time as long as an entire lifetime. but not everybody alive in the world at that time would experience their life
00:35:07 ►
as an uninterrupted plunge into novelty. No. So a large percentage of people might. There is this
00:35:16 ►
phenomenon of the zeitgeist, you know, and to the degree that we participate in our time,
00:35:23 ►
the degree that we participate in our time,
00:35:30 ►
our life is in concert with the larger wave.
00:35:37 ►
This wave has durations of cycles in it, and one of the cycles, the cycle we’re living through now,
00:35:41 ►
stretches from 1945 to 2012. It actually stretches from the Hiroshima
00:35:48 ►
bomb blast to the winter solstice of 2012. Well, I was born 18 months after that event.
00:35:59 ►
So if I have a personal time wave, it will end 18 months after the end of this wave. How can that be when
00:36:07 ►
this wave seems to dictate the end of all lesser waves? Another mystery to be unraveled by traversing
00:36:16 ►
the territory. Yeah. Well, I don’t know what the time wave is is portraying I mean in other words
00:36:27 ►
novelty how is it transmitted how is it
00:36:32 ►
is it detectable can we build a meter
00:36:35 ►
other than this time wave could we build
00:36:38 ►
a parallel technology which would
00:36:40 ►
confirm the existence of this thing you
00:36:43 ►
know what can you do with novelty?
00:36:46 ►
The electromagnetic field, it turned out,
00:36:48 ►
you can transmit information, light cities,
00:36:52 ►
smelt metal, if you know how to do the trick.
00:36:55 ►
What you could do with this, I’m not sure.
00:37:00 ►
You see, if the last cycle from 1945 to 2012 is real, then in a sense, all larger cycles are compacted into it.
00:37:12 ►
In a sense, from 1945 to 2012, we’re reliving the entire history of the world.
00:37:21 ►
If that’s true, then we have reached roughly a thousand AD. That means that between now
00:37:31 ►
and 2012, we must traverse a, I don’t even have the words for it, a domain of cultural change equivalent to the domain we traversed between 1000 AD and the present.
00:37:50 ►
In other words, slightly more than a thousand years of resonances have to be compacted into the next 16 years.
00:38:00 ►
Consequently, there’s this feeling of things moving faster and faster in a universe which was actually
00:38:10 ►
built on this kind of architecture imagine this a universe that actually had this kind of closure
00:38:18 ►
where it was a series of where each time cycle was 164th the size of the one that preceded it,
00:38:27 ►
before a universe of that structure reached the domain of Planck’s constant,
00:38:32 ►
6.55 times 10 to the minus 25 erg seconds,
00:38:38 ►
it would undergo half of its unfolding into existence
00:38:44 ►
in the last hour and 35 minutes before the crunch.
00:38:50 ►
In other words, if this is the kind of universe that we’re living in, half of the unfoldment
00:38:56 ►
into novelty will occur in the last day of the existence. That’s how huge these rates of acceleration are. So when people ask the
00:39:08 ►
question, what will happen in 2012, they’re asking you to see around the corner nine times.
00:39:16 ►
It can’t be done. Language fails. Apparently, as far as I can tell, what novelty, what will happen as novelty asymptotically increases in the final months, hours, minutes, milliseconds, is boundaries will dissolve.
00:39:37 ►
All boundaries.
00:39:39 ►
They’re already dissolving.
00:39:41 ►
We see the nation state dissolving, but the atomic field dissolving. We see the nation-state dissolving, but wait till the atomic field dissolves.
00:39:49 ►
Everything is apparently crunching together in some kind of meltdown. It’s the equivalent of
00:39:58 ►
a black hole, but it’s not a gravitational collapse. It’s a novelty collapse. We are collapsing into a black hole of novelty.
00:40:08 ►
And I’ve tried to imagine, how could this happen? What could happen without
00:40:16 ►
God’s direct intervention, A, and B, fleets of extraterrestrial starships appearing over every city on the planet?
00:40:27 ►
In other words, is there anything that we could self-generate that would fulfill this kind of a scenario?
00:40:36 ►
And it turns out I found at least one answer, which is time travel.
00:40:52 ►
answer, which is time travel. If, in fact, what happens in 2012 is that we begin the conquest of this previously unscratched dimension called time, then it is perfectly reasonable that a linear
00:41:00 ►
depiction of the ebb and flow of novelty would stop at a certain point because once time becomes
00:41:09 ►
non-linear, you can’t portray it on a Cartesian graph anymore. You need a higher dimensional
00:41:16 ►
matrix. It starts coming at you out of the screen. The novelty overflows the dimensional container you’ve built for it. Interestingly,
00:41:28 ►
when I had this idea 15 years ago, there was no idea in greater contempt in the scientific
00:41:36 ►
journals. I mean, time travel, ha ha ha, the grandfather paradox, this and that and the other thing. Now it’s a perfectly respectable thing to discuss.
00:41:48 ►
There are schemes for time travel on the books that would work.
00:41:54 ►
It would require some godlike technology.
00:41:57 ►
I mean, in other words, you have to be able to spin a cylinder
00:42:00 ►
that is the size of Jupiter, nine-tenths the speed of light. But if you can spin such a
00:42:08 ►
cylinder at such a speed and travel along its horizontal axis, you will in fact be moved
00:42:14 ►
backward through time. Everybody agrees on this. They just say you can’t do it.
00:42:20 ►
Well, hell, where have we heard that before? We can’t do it But yes, if you can think of it, you can do it
00:42:28 ►
And if there’s a crude brute force way to do it
00:42:31 ►
Then there’s a subtle, tricky, easy way to do it
00:42:36 ►
That comes along a little bit later
00:42:38 ►
I mean, the vacuum tube was not the end of that line of development
00:42:43 ►
And what we’re talking about here is a vacuum tube version
00:42:47 ►
of a time machine. And a time machine may not be what we think it is. You know, the future is not
00:42:57 ►
like the past, except that it hasn’t happened. If you were to suddenly find yourself in the future,
00:43:06 ►
it’s a vector storm of unrealized possibilities.
00:43:11 ►
You’ve never seen an unrealized possibility.
00:43:14 ►
All you’ve ever seen are realized possibilities,
00:43:17 ►
and you don’t know what an unrealized possibility would look like.
00:43:21 ►
There are a lot more of them than there are realized
00:43:26 ►
possibilities, and they fill the space called the future. If you suddenly found yourself in the future,
00:43:32 ►
you wouldn’t even recognize it as that. You just think you’ve gone mad, I think.
00:43:38 ►
So,
00:43:43 ►
I I don’t know if I should wrap this up,
00:43:47 ►
but the basic notion is
00:43:48 ►
this is what I learned from psychedelics.
00:43:52 ►
This is my show and tell.
00:43:55 ►
It’s an indulgence of my ego to do this
00:44:00 ►
because most of what I tell you,
00:44:02 ►
you could learn somewhere else.
00:44:04 ►
I just have read the books and can regurgitate this stuff, point what I tell you, you could learn somewhere else. I just have read the books
00:44:05 ►
and can regurgitate this stuff, point you toward the plants, lead you through the philosophical
00:44:11 ►
issues, talk about the medical stuff. It’s not particularly flashy. It’s just a mental shortcut
00:44:18 ►
for you. This is original and nobody has ever tried to wrest it from my grasp.
00:44:26 ►
That’s how original it is.
00:44:28 ►
Nobody else wants the hideous responsibility of defending this particular piece of intellectual baggage.
00:44:36 ►
Why I like it is I believe that the idea which is the most fun is probably closest to the truth.
00:44:49 ►
And I find this idea to be absolutely delightful.
00:44:55 ►
It also has a kind of weird completeness about it,
00:45:02 ►
even though nobody has made any contribution to this theory
00:45:07 ►
but me. In other words, I thought it up, talked to bottom, start to finish. It
00:45:12 ►
doesn’t feel to me like a human being could do that. It feels to me like it
00:45:17 ►
would take… that this is the product of an entire civilization. It must have taken hundreds of years. Many workers spread
00:45:28 ►
out in space and time. I can tell it, and I was told it. That’s how I know it. But no single
00:45:37 ►
individual, and certainly not myself, could have dreamed this up from scratch. Yeah. How long was this whole thing?
00:45:47 ►
You mean before I had the whole thing?
00:45:49 ►
Yeah.
00:45:50 ►
From 1971 to 75.
00:45:54 ►
And it was interesting,
00:45:57 ►
and this I cannot ever share with anybody else,
00:46:01 ►
you’ll just have to believe me,
00:46:02 ►
but the way it was revealed was very odd
00:46:07 ►
because it never let me see where I was going. I couldn’t figure out what I was doing. I mean,
00:46:16 ►
it said, go buy graph paper. Go get your I Ching. Look at the King Wen sequence.
00:46:26 ►
Graph the first order of difference.
00:46:30 ►
And I would try and guess, what are we doing?
00:46:33 ►
Are we discovering an ancient Chinese calendar?
00:46:37 ►
Are we, what, why are we doing that?
00:46:39 ►
And they said, no, no, don’t worry about that.
00:46:41 ►
Just keep, you know, next step.
00:46:44 ►
And it always hid from me where I was headed.
00:46:48 ►
It still hides from me where I’m headed.
00:46:54 ►
You know, and the software has been written.
00:46:59 ►
The controversy rages on the Internet.
00:47:02 ►
I even now have critics.
00:47:04 ►
That’s good. That shows that it
00:47:07 ►
is moving out of the realm of private Idaho into the realm of debatable cultural artifact.
00:47:30 ►
And I think that if it’s true or if it has a part of the truth, we will know before 2012. this prediction about 1996 and then watched the ensuing debate, my critics, my defense,
00:47:48 ►
their response, so forth and so on. So it’s being watched and the meme spreads and apparently
00:47:58 ►
will be helped by things like simply where we are in relationship to the calendar,
00:48:07 ►
by things like simply where we are in relationship to the calendar, simply because we’re approaching a millennial turn. The producers of nitwit TV shows want to talk to me. They say, I understand
00:48:14 ►
you have a way of predicting the future given to you by UFOs, I heard. We want to put you on the air well you know I’m not sure
00:48:26 ►
about the
00:48:28 ►
wisdom of all of this
00:48:30 ►
but I figure you know let the meme
00:48:32 ►
fight for its life
00:48:34 ►
in the jungle
00:48:36 ►
of competing
00:48:38 ►
models of reality
00:48:40 ►
when I pull back
00:48:42 ►
from the specificity
00:48:44 ►
and the fact that I
00:48:46 ►
invented it, that’s my biggest
00:48:48 ►
problem. If I hadn’t invented
00:48:50 ►
this, if I just heard that somebody
00:48:52 ►
invented it and this is what it was
00:48:54 ►
I think I would find it very interesting
00:48:57 ►
but since I know
00:48:58 ►
the inventor very well
00:49:00 ►
I’m very prone to
00:49:02 ►
doubt the thing
00:49:04 ►
I mean this is not a guy you would want
00:49:07 ►
to put a lot of pressure on. So, I don’t know. I’m puzzled, and I offer it as an unsolved puzzle. I preached here earlier that you mustn’t seek closure, and so I don’t with this.
00:49:32 ►
If it’s a communication, it’s a very curious communication. If it is non-communication, it’s even more curious. If it’s a delusion, why is it so mathematically formal? If I’m pathological,
00:49:51 ►
why aren’t there attendance sequelae? Why just this very defined thing?
00:49:58 ►
The whole thing smacks of the impossible. It’s even pushed me toward the idea
00:50:05 ►
that maybe this is not actually a reality.
00:50:09 ►
We’re trapped, or I’m trapped,
00:50:11 ►
I don’t know if you’re trapped,
00:50:12 ►
but we’re in some kind of piece of fiction.
00:50:16 ►
It’s like a Philip K. Dick deal, you know?
00:50:19 ►
We’re in some kind of simulacrum,
00:50:22 ►
and the clue to the fact that it’s a simulacrum is this impossible idea.
00:50:28 ►
And so the point of the idea is not to believe it, but to use it as a wedge to fight our way out of this labyrinth and back to whatever reality we were in before we fell into this situation.
00:50:43 ►
Something like that. Anyway, I have the feeling that i’m blathering
00:50:47 ►
and spinning my wheels are there any is there some final question that brings this all to a yeah
00:50:54 ►
oh yeah that is an interesting question like people say, are you, is this some kind of permission for irresponsibility?
00:51:07 ►
Are you saying that the world is going to transform itself no matter what happens?
00:51:16 ►
I’m enough of an old political activist to sense the anguish behind that question, because I don’t want to say, yes,
00:51:28 ►
don’t worry about the Palestinians. Don’t worry about the Bangladeshis. It’s a done deal.
00:51:34 ►
It’s all fine. You can take your eye off the ball and your foot off the pedal.
00:51:40 ►
That seems crazy to me, to give advice like that.
00:51:55 ►
And yet this thing seems to be saying, it is a done deal, it’s going to be fine, it’s going to arrive on schedule, under budget, you don’t have to preach it, you don’t have to worry about it. And so then apparently where it lies is that it is a done deal, but how the deal is done is not a done deal.
00:52:08 ►
That there will be a deal is sealed.
00:52:12 ►
That is written into the laws of physics,
00:52:15 ►
if this is correct.
00:52:17 ►
No escape from the transcendence,
00:52:20 ►
but how we present ourselves to it is our contribution.
00:52:28 ►
It does not say what will happen.
00:52:32 ►
It simply says where the novelty will cluster,
00:52:36 ►
and apparently it is still open to what happens
00:52:43 ►
is still a matter of human decision
00:52:46 ►
and of the unfolding of causal necessity.
00:52:51 ►
So in a sense it’s saying there is a safety net under you,
00:52:54 ►
but you still should make an effort not to fall.
00:52:59 ►
Yeah, Al.
00:53:07 ►
I hear what you’re saying.
00:53:12 ►
Yes, a strange thing about the Mayan calendar is it begins in, I believe, 3135 BC
00:53:18 ►
and it ends in 2012.
00:53:23 ►
The Mayan civilization began, as far as anybody can tell, around 300 BC and was a done
00:53:33 ►
deal by 790 AD. So here was a culture that lived by a calendar that seemed to have no relationship to its own cultural origins or ends.
00:53:48 ►
That’s odd. I mean, that’s not how people do a calendar. The other weird thing about the Mayan
00:53:54 ►
calendar is it begins on a slow Thursday in August. In other words, it doesn’t begin at a solstice. It doesn’t begin at an equinox.
00:54:05 ►
It doesn’t begin with a special astrological configuration in the sky.
00:54:11 ►
It begins on nothing burger day in 3135 BC.
00:54:20 ►
Well, but it runs forward to a winter solstice and ends precisely on a winter solstice.
00:54:28 ►
Whoever heard of a calendar that was formed by calculating backward from a point thousands of years in the future?
00:54:37 ►
What kind of squirrely culture would do that?
00:54:40 ►
And the answer is, we don’t know.
00:55:09 ►
that? And the answer is, we had astronomy, they had politics, poetry,
00:55:19 ►
architecture, and they don’t owe anything to Greece or Egypt or Sumeria or Babylon or Ur or Chaldea. They thought it up themselves. They did it themselves. They met problem after problem
00:55:27 ►
after problem and solved them in astonishingly unique ways. And, you know, it’s just a matter
00:55:35 ►
of cultural accident. When Cortés sailed into the Bay of Campeche, the difference between medieval Spanish civilization and the civilization
00:55:47 ►
of the Aztecs in terms of technological level and understanding, they were practically on a par.
00:55:55 ►
I mean, the Spanish had no antibiotics, they had no advanced weaponry, no advanced communication. They had better ships, but had the voyage not been done
00:56:08 ►
that way, 150 years later, the Aztecs might have landed on the coast of Spain and claimed it for
00:56:16 ►
a Montezuma successor. That’s how nearly in parallel they were. But then, of course, the bifurcation was tremendous.
00:56:26 ►
One civilization wiped out,
00:56:28 ►
and the other, through the looting of the former,
00:56:33 ►
finances its way into modern science.
00:56:35 ►
And 500 years later, we have atom bombs
00:56:38 ►
and antibiotics and DNA sequencing.
00:56:42 ►
Anyway, that’s it for this evening.
00:56:44 ►
Thank you for your attention and your indulgence.
00:56:48 ►
I’m very grateful to you.
00:56:52 ►
You’re listening to The Psychedelic Salon,
00:56:54 ►
where people are changing their lives one thought at a time.
00:57:00 ►
Okay, so here’s my current take on the time wave.
00:57:04 ►
But if you’re hearing this after the end of the year 2009,
00:57:08 ►
I may have changed my mind once again.
00:57:11 ►
And I’m only going to give you the headline for now.
00:57:14 ►
And that is the thought that maybe the 2012 date
00:57:18 ►
is simply where the downward plunge of novelty
00:57:21 ►
came to the end of the graph paper we’ve been using.
00:57:24 ►
I’d like to see what happens when the end date is pushed out a few more millennia.
00:57:28 ►
Will it continue downward as it has so far, or will it eventually go up for a few eons?
00:57:34 ►
What I’m saying is that while I think there may be some uses for the time wave theory,
00:57:39 ►
it may be more along the lines of consolidating it with astrology or something like that,
00:57:45 ►
rather than to be used as a predictor of potential doom and gloom.
00:57:50 ►
So I’m hoping that sometime in early 2013,
00:57:54 ►
once things return for whatever is passing as normal at the moment,
00:57:59 ►
that work will begin in earnest to untangle the mystery of the McKenna time wave hypothesis.
00:58:06 ►
You know, it was kind of interesting to me when Terence said he thought that
00:58:10 ►
the U.S. moon flight was the capstone of modernism.
00:58:15 ►
That took place in July of 1969, and for many years I’ve been saying that
00:58:20 ►
I thought that was the peak of the American empire.
00:58:24 ►
Well, here’s another thing that happened right around that time.
00:58:28 ►
At least according to Wikipedia, it was also in 1969 that President Richard the Dick Nixon
00:58:35 ►
first used the term war on drugs.
00:58:38 ►
Those were some pivotal times, 1967 through 1969, and the shape of the time wave for the next 12 months is
00:58:47 ►
quite similar to the wave that covered those two years interesting huh and if you’ve read
00:58:54 ►
richard tarnas’s excellent book cosmos and psyche then you probably thought about it when terence
00:59:00 ►
was talking about the similarity of the shape of the time wave between 1944 and 1996
00:59:06 ►
with that of the shape of the time wave from the late Egyptian time to the Umayyad Caliphate,
00:59:13 ►
and then he asked the question,
00:59:15 ►
is there anything about the world of Homer that is like the world of 1967?
00:59:21 ►
Now, if you’ve read Tarnas, you know that he uses astrological configurations that
00:59:26 ►
affect entire generations to map over the ebb and flow of human history. And I guess
00:59:33 ►
here’s a spoiler alert if you haven’t read Tarnas’ book, but he says that the times that
00:59:39 ►
we are currently in are closest, at least astrologically, to the year 1500.
00:59:46 ►
So that’s your assignment for the week.
00:59:48 ►
Read a little history and figure out how today reflects those times.
00:59:52 ►
And if you’re up to it, why not leave your opinion on our Skype voicemail,
00:59:57 ►
which you can reach through our Skype number,
00:59:59 ►
which is the word psychedelicsalon, all one word, all lowercase.
01:00:04 ►
And here’s another idea.
01:00:06 ►
Why don’t you try to slide the time wave forward so that the ending point is thousands or even hundreds of thousands of years into the future?
01:00:13 ►
And see if it’ll line up in important points just as Terrence did when he ended it at 2012.
01:00:20 ►
Terrence said that what he did was to take the two data sets and find the best fit between them.
01:00:26 ►
Well, maybe he got the best fit wrong.
01:00:28 ►
Maybe there’s a better best fit that has its end date 20,000 years in the future.
01:00:34 ►
I messed around with this a little myself and discovered that I could find a lot of time wave matches
01:00:40 ►
with historical and geographical events in the past by just sliding it forward past its 2012 endpoint.
01:00:48 ►
So maybe it’s time to reset the time wave
01:00:51 ►
and start both it and the Mayan calendar over again.
01:00:56 ►
Another interesting thing to do might be to consider
01:00:58 ►
the fractal nature of both the time wave and of history itself.
01:01:03 ►
For example, historians argue among themselves that the Roman Empire fell sometime between the years wave and of history itself. For example, historians argue among themselves
01:01:06 ►
that the Roman Empire fell sometime between the years 350 and 1000.
01:01:11 ►
And if you look at the time wave, it more or less matches that period
01:01:14 ►
if you consider the end of the Roman Empire to be a descent into novelty.
01:01:19 ►
Of course, that could be argued as well, I guess.
01:01:23 ►
Now, if history repeats itself, or is perhaps
01:01:25 ►
fractal, then there may be some other interesting correlations there. But for me, all of this
01:01:32 ►
is a little too much like divination of some kind. Remember, early on in his talk, Terence
01:01:38 ►
went on at length that each moment is unique. And if that’s so, then I don’t see how history of necessity has to repeat itself.
01:01:47 ►
Unless, of course, we humans keep on making the same mistakes over and over without ever learning from them.
01:01:54 ►
And, by the way, if you want to see the time wave for yourself and play around with it a little bit,
01:01:59 ►
you can find an interactive version of the time wave calculator at timewave2012.com slash tools slash calculator.
01:02:09 ►
And I’ll post a link to that along with the program notes for today’s podcast.
01:02:14 ►
Now, just a couple more things before I sign off for today.
01:02:18 ►
And the first is to give a shout out to our fellow salonners in and around Nelson, Canada.
01:02:23 ►
out to our fellow salonners in and around Nelson, Canada.
01:02:28 ►
Just before I came down with my cold, I had a great conversation with Dustin Cantwell on his Thane of the Cosmos radio program
01:02:31 ►
on Kootenai Co-op Radio. And his program airs from
01:02:35 ►
10 to 12 on Sunday nights and streams over the net. So, if you’re
01:02:39 ►
up late on a Sunday night and want a little company, just surf over to
01:02:43 ►
93.5 in Nelson, Canada,
01:02:46 ►
and join Dustin and friends.
01:02:48 ►
And I think there’s also a podcast of some of his shows.
01:02:52 ►
Anyway, I send warm and sunshiny greetings to you
01:02:55 ►
salonners up in Canada from the beaches down here in Southern California.
01:03:01 ►
Actually, even though there’s more stuff I’d like to cover right now,
01:03:04 ►
I guess I’d better cut this off because I’m getting stuffed up again
01:03:07 ►
and at least get this much out for today.
01:03:10 ►
Hopefully I’ll be able to get the last part of this workshop out to you in the next few days.
01:03:15 ►
Well, so I’ll close today’s podcast again by reminding you that
01:03:20 ►
this and most of the podcasts from the Psychedelic Salon
01:03:23 ►
are freely available for you to
01:03:25 ►
use in your own audio projects under the creative commons attribution non-commercial share alike 3.0
01:03:30 ►
license and if you have any questions about that just click the creative commons link at the bottom
01:03:36 ►
of the psychedelic salon web page which you can find at psychedelicsalon.org and if you’re interested
01:03:42 ►
in the philosophy behind the psychedelic salon,
01:03:48 ►
you can hear all about it in my novel, The Genesis Generation,
01:03:54 ►
which is available as an audiobook that you can download at genesisgeneration.us.
01:03:58 ►
And I also want to add a huge thank you to the 16 kind souls who purchased a copy of The Genesis Generation last month.
01:04:02 ►
Your support means an awful lot to me.
01:04:04 ►
And for now, this is Lorenzo signing off from Cyberdelic Space. of the Genesis generation last month. Your support means an awful lot to me.
01:04:07 ►
And for now, this is Lorenzo,
01:04:09 ►
signing off from Cyberdelic Space.
01:04:11 ►
Be well, my friends.